What do you think about these verses?


#1

‘‘19For what is our hope, or joy, or crown of glory? Are not you, in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming? 20For you are our glory and joy.’’


#2

Some context would be helpful. Where are these verses?


#3

1 Thessalonians 2:19-20

I think Paul was expressing his hopes that the Thessalonians would be converted to Christianity and saved.


#4

My take, after reading the preceding verses, is that the Thessalonians had already come to believe and that this is what Paul refers to as ‘our glory and joy.’ He’s happy that his preaching had a positive outcome.


#5

Sounds right. The Revised Standard Version makes it a little clearer.

For what is our hope or joy or crown of boasting before our Lord Jesus at his coming? Is it not you? For you are our glory and joy.


#6

I agree with what Beachcomber said too.


#7

So my view on this is that the first question asked by Paul is ‘‘what is our hope, or joy, or crown of glory’’… He is referring to the treasures in heaven Christ spoke about. This ‘‘crown’’ is ‘‘you will have treasure in heaven’’. And then he states it is the faithful, his flock, that are this ‘‘crown’’… So essentially bringing in more people into Christ is the glory he works for?


#8

*Satan hindered us. * That is, has raised such an aversion to me among the pagans and Jews of Thessalonica, that my friends do not think it safe I should come among you. I am now detained from you by violence; but when this life is past, you shall form my joy and my crown. I will present you at the tribunal of my Saviour, and say: Behold me and my children; behold the fruits of my labours, the proofs of my fidelity, and my claims for a recompense.
–Calmet


#9

I think that they, and all of 1 Thess, are a wonderful part of Scripture.

What do you think of them?


#10

I agree with his interpretation here

I will present you at the tribunal of my Saviour, and say: Behold me and my children; behold the fruits of my labours, the proofs of my fidelity, and my claims for a recompense.
–Calmet

This last part seems to indicate Paul was working to atone for his sins (tribunal… claims for a recompense)… That is not in line with what a ‘‘free gift’’ of life is… and did not Christ already remove the Tribunal? the ‘‘debt of transgressions’’?


#11

I sorta already mentioned it above… My thoughts on these are that they are very enlightening in the sense that they show us what was the fruit of His labors… the people. So what about the people is His crown? Perhaps it’s trying to understand the connection between His flock at Thess that he was writing to, and His crown? I understand they ARE his crown, but why?


#12

I think Paul is talking about the last judgement when we will have to give an accounting before God. He is saying to God “this is what I’ve done with the talents you’ve entrusted to me – I have given you back many disciples of Christ”.


#13

I think this is a great view here… Thank you! That helped clarify these verses for me


#14

I think it is saying that his works are evidence of his faith. There is nothing heretical in that. Without works, your professed faith is a lie.

*“Do you see that by works a man is justified; and not by faith only?.. For even as the body without the spirit is dead; so also faith without works is dead.” *
James 2:24


#15

I do not disagree. But do works add to the ‘‘free gift of life’’ in Christ? if so how?


#16

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