What happens in baptism?


#1

According to Church teaching a baptised child receives justification and the theological virtues among other things. Faith, Hope, Love are in the soul of the person…but well, as we see the child is not miraculously transformed by baptism so that they have all faith and love and hope as soon as they start speaking and understanding…so I’ve been wondering what this doctrine means in practice and I got this idea that it probably means that God treats the person as someone having faith, hope and love, but that naturally and humanly speaking the child must conform its character to those maximums over time, and God gives the grace for it. So God in a way sees the merits and virtues of Christ on the newborn baby who has put on Christ, but the baby doesn’t really subjectively possess those virtues, although objectively(from God’s point of view) does… I wanted to ask if this view is orthodox because it’s the only satisfying way for me to understand what baptism does…so I hope it’s not wrong:) thanks
Emil


#2

**Catechism of the Catholic Church

1231** Where infant Baptism has become the form in which this sacrament is usually celebrated, it has become a single act encapsulating the preparatory stages of Christian initiation in a very abridged way. By its very nature infant Baptism requires a post-baptismal catechumenate. Not only is there a need for instruction after Baptism, but also for the necessary flowering of baptismal grace in personal growth. The catechism has its proper place here.


#3

Is not every baby created in the womb and born into this world possess the gift of innocence from sin that is given by God? It is the sins of this world that withers away the innocence of children. When that happens, the baptism of repentance is necessary. Complete submersion. Some might sneer and say- “Oh how do you know a child is ready for baptism?” Well the parents or caretakers of the children if they live in the spirit of Jesus would know. Thats why it is so important to reach out to orphanges to see that this need is taken care of.

I cant believe the questions we throw around each other today about the little ones that have their lives cut short on them, whether it be from abortion or any other sin enduced death(sickness, accidental, murder). We ask- “Does the soul of a child go to heaven if one of these events happen and baptism never took place?”

So we wait for an answer that comes from the Vatican and than say-“ooohhhh, ahhhhhh”

Read Matthew 19:13-15 and Mark 10:13-16
In short, JESUS TEACHES-“Do not hinder little children for the kingdom of God belongs to children such as these” “I tell you the truth, anyone who will not receive the Kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it.”

So where does Jesus talk about the little ones original sin? It seems our God honors the innocence, while the sins of this world destroy it.

You do not need to look this up on page 2957 in your cathecism book to find this out.

If you need more sound doctrine on this issue you obviously need your ear tickled with something else.

The thief on the cross confessed his sins first-hand to Jesus on the cross. Everyone else, total submersion in water.


#4

[quote=1Christ1Church]Is not every baby created in the womb and born into this world possess the gift of innocence from sin that is given by God? It is the sins of this world that withers away the innocence of children. When that happens, the baptism of repentance is necessary. Complete submersion. Some might sneer and say- “Oh how do you know a child is ready for baptism?” Well the parents or caretakers of the children if they live in the spirit of Jesus would know. Thats why it is so important to reach out to orphanges to see that this need is taken care of.

I cant believe the questions we throw around each other today about the little ones that have their lives cut short on them, whether it be from abortion or any other sin enduced death(sickness, accidental, murder). We ask- “Does the soul of a child go to heaven if one of these events happen and baptism never took place?”

So we wait for an answer that comes from the Vatican and than say-“ooohhhh, ahhhhhh”

Read Matthew 19:13-15 and Mark 10:13-16
In short, JESUS TEACHES-“Do not hinder little children for the kingdom of God belongs to children such as these” “I tell you the truth, anyone who will not receive the Kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it.”

So where does Jesus talk about the little ones original sin? It seems our God honors the innocence, while the sins of this world destroy it.

You do not need to look this up on page 2957 in your cathecism book to find this out.

If you need more sound doctrine on this issue you obviously need your ear tickled with something else.

The thief on the cross confessed his sins first-hand to Jesus on the cross. Everyone else, total submersion in water.
[/quote]

By what authority do you interpret scripture?


#5

Check out Ezekiel 36:25-27.

These verses show that something really does happen at baptism per God’s own design. It also shows the sacramental aspects of Baptism.

That is, there is an outward sign (sprinkled water) to produce an inward change in His people.

This is NOT a symbolic sign for the supposedly already saved individual as is evident in these verses.

Kevin


#6

No.I was born guilty, a sinner, even as my mother conceived me.
Psalm 51:7

… through the disobedience of one person the many were made sinners …
Romans 5:19


#7

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.