What is the Pope's job description?


#1

Hello All:wave:

Hi before I ask my questions I would like to put out a disclaimer: Most of you know me here and that I am not disrespectful, I am just trying to understand your POV. So, if any of my remarks sound disrespectful or sarcastic, they are not it is just hard to read tone over the internet.:frowning: I truly just want my questions answered to the best of anyone’s ability.

OK with that said:D

1.)What is the Pope’s job description. What does he do at the Vatican?

2.)Besides the one passage in Matthew–can you show me where in the bible we are suppose to follow Apostolic Succession or have One overall leader of the church?

3.) Is it said explicitly or implicitly or not at all that we are to follow one man on earth for complete guidance in understanding scripture.

If you have links that would be fine. Please though not too long:o

Thank you for all responses.:thumbsup:


#2
  1. This will help some: it’s from Catholic Culture. catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=110

  2. Can you show me where in the Bible it says that everything about the Church and its entire structure, organization, and development is to be found ‘only’ in the Bible (especially for those pesky 350 years of the early church where there was no ‘Bible’ available as we know it)? :smiley: But you can of course consider (in context) the letters of St. Paul, St. Peter, St. James and St. John as they commented on the growth of the church, and also the works of the early church fathers who were first hand observers of how the church ‘grew’. Also the part in the Bible about how Jesus said and did many other things which were not ‘written down’ and add this to St. Paul telling us to hold fast to traditions we hear, both ‘by letter and by word-of-mouth’.

  3. We rely on Christ and the Holy Spirit who speak to us in the teachings of the Church (the ordinary Magesterium) and Christ Himself gave ‘the keys’ to Peter and Peter’s successors. It is the Church who gives the understanding of the Scriptures through the guidance of the Spirit; as far as the Pope, anything that he teaches, in matters of faith and morals alone, is ‘protected’ by the Spirit (The one who will guide us, according to Scripture, to all truth) from error. IOW, you will never hear of a Pope suddenly teaching us that there is a Dynamic Duo or Fab Four “God” instead of a Trinity. Also, a Pope will never take scripture and ‘add new’, or ‘change existing’. Thus, you will not find a Pope teaching that Jesus did not actually suffer and die for us, as Scripture says. Or, to bring things a little closer to current events, that the sin of Sodom was ‘inhospitality’.

God bless!!

I recommend highly www.vatican.va and of course, any of the experts at EWTN would be glad to address this. You can also look right here at the library on “The Papacy”.


#3

John 21:15-17
**When they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Feed my lambs.” **
**A second time he said to him, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Tend my sheep.” **
**He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time, “Do you love me?” And he said to him, “Lord, you know everything; you know that I love you.” Jesus said to him, "Feed my sheep. **

So I would say that his job description is “to feed the sheep”.


#4

Baaaaaaaaaaa! :yup:


#5

The pope is “the servant of the servants of God.” This comes from Jesus’ teaching about how his followers are not to lord it over others but be their servants. Even in the secular world our leaders are called “public servants” because they are elected to serve the people.

Peter’s primacy is shown throughout the Gospels and the NT. Look at all the times he is mentioned first or singled out for special instructions from the Lord.

He was the one who spoke for the Church on the day of Pentecost. Why? Why not James (who was the bishop of Jerusalem)? Because Peter was appointed to be the head of the Church on earth by Christ himself.

Peter went to Rome and was martyred there and his successor is known to us–St. Linus, the second pope/bishop of Rome.

Here is the List of all the Popes.


#6

His job is to lead and strengthen ALL Christians.

[quote="www.drbo.org] Luke 22:32 And the Lord said: Simon, Simon, behold Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: 32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou, being once converted, confirm thy brethren. 33 Who said to him: Lord, I am ready to go with thee, both into prison, and to death. 34 And he said: I say to thee, Peter, the cock shall not crow this day, till thou thrice deniest that thou knowest me
[/quote]

Except Matthew 16:19??? LOL Can you show me from Scripture without using Scripture??? LOL, o.k.

[quote="www.drbo.org] John 21:15 When therefore they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter: Simon son of John, lovest thou me more than these? He saith to him: Yea, Lord, thou knowest that I love thee. He saith to him: Feed my lambs.16 He saith to him again: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? He saith to him: Yea, Lord, thou knowest that I love thee. He saith to him: Feed my lambs. 17 He said to him the third time: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved, because he had said to him the third time: Lovest thou me? And he said to him: Lord, thou knowest all things: thou knowest that I love thee. He said to him: Feed my sheep.
[/quote]

This commission is from Jesus to “Feed” His sheep and His lambs. This represents the whole Church (Protestants included… LOL) It’s directed to Peter, and Peter alone, in fact Peter as opposed the "more than “these” (the rest of the disciples).

[quote=www.drbo.org] Luke 10:16 He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth me; and he that despiseth me, despiseth him that sent me.
[/quote]

Since the Pope is the leader of all of the Church, and he guides all Christians, he who listens to the Pope listens to Jesus (according to Scripture of course).


#7

I don’t know what He does at the Vatican (I know if I worked there, I’d simply never get anything done. It’s just too beautiful :)), but my favorite of his titles is Servus servorum Dei, that is, Servant of the Servants of God. He has other job descriptions, but that’s my favorite :slight_smile:

2.)Besides the one passage in Matthew–can you show me where in the bible we are suppose to follow Apostolic Succession or have One overall leader of the church?

The apostolic succession is indicated by the selection of Matthias to replace Judas, by the appointment of Timothy and Titus by Paul (as his successors) and his subsequent command that they appoint further successors (2 Timothy 2, Titus 1).

It’s supported by Christ’s granting to the Apostles authority in the “Great Commission” and His promise that he’d be with them always.

It’s supported by the simple fact that we see an authoritative Church in Scripture, but we never see any description of how that authority should continue after the death of the Apostles except through their successors. Given the choice between the Apostolic Succession (which has scriptural support) and the common “election” of leaders done in most Protestant Churches (which has no Scriptural support whatsoever) I’ll take the succession :slight_smile:

3.) Is it said explicitly or implicitly or not at all that we are to follow one man on earth for complete guidance in understanding scripture.

Everyone has an “ordinary” – that is, his bishop or the priests put in charge by him, that we are subject to. We are commanded to obey them, our leaders, in Hebrews 13. Our obedience to Pope follows from this, since our bishop’s leader is the Pope. The pope is our “extraordinary” leader, as opposed to our “ordinary” leader, our bishop.

Jeremy


#8

hee hee look at my signature :wink:

In my opinion, no better way to describe his job.

With respect to Apostolic Succession. There are several concepts that can easily be used to show various aspects… Forgive me for not knowing exact chapter verse… a failing of mine… I’ve focused too much on the what and the why, and not so much the where in the bible.

Anyway
Concept 1
Empty Seats
In Acts, We are told that someone is needed to fill the seat vacated by Judas. If there is no need for apostolic succession, why is there even a mention for a need to fill the seat.

Concept 2
Need For Elders and Church Leaders
Timothy talks about the need for good solid leaders. Without those leaders, the church would have flailed out of control. So too with any organized fill in the blank. It needs guidance. Considering that there is an entire chapter devoted to who can be a leader, as well as a reiteration in Titus (by the way, my favorite book. Titus is a great place to start when summing up all of the NT. no new concepts introduces, only reiteration), Leaders are highly important

Concept 3
The Greatest of all…
In Mark there is a debate that goes on between the apostles on who is the Greatest. This is telling because the Apostles felt that someone should be in charge. Second and more important. Jesus’s response is very telling. He did not say that all were equal. He said that the greatest among you must be the least and a servant to all. (My signature) However, this was not meant as a slap, as he follows it by saying “just as the son of man came not to be served, but to serve”

Concept 4
Laying on of Hands
A very important part of becoming an elder is the laying on of hands. If you did not have someone lay their hands on you, then you are not a valid elder. There are several catches to this. The person laying his hands on you, must have also had hands laid on him, as well the person who laid HIS hands on That person… so on and so forth… all the way back to the Apostles. If you cannot trace the lineage of laying on hands back to the apostles, you are not a valid elder… Apostolic succession in its purest form.
There is a second catch. The Holy spirit is no longer with someone that is Anathematized. So, someone in Heresy cannot validly ordain

Concept 5
Matthew…
You know these arguments… but lets take the one verse everyone has issues with out. There are two other verses directed at Peter to indicate his status. He gives Peter the Keys. You give the keys to the person you want in charge. Anything you hold I hold. He’s trusting peter to make the right decisions. Again, you dont tell that to everyone, just the one you want in charge. However, taking this a step further… Jesus wont give someone the ability to make decisions Jesus is going to hold, unless he can ensure that those decisions will never counter him… In other words… Infallible teachings with respect to faith and morals

Concept 6
Shadow of in the Old
As with everything, there must be some shadow of theology x in the OT. The whole Old is revealed in the New thing. There was always always always a head of the faith. Personally, I consider Moses the first proto-Pope :wink:

So…
If Jesus says someone is to be the greatest, that means a Pope at least for the apostles time. This person will be protected from errors in teaching Faith and Morals. However Acts said vacant seats must be filled. Vacant seats must also be filled by someone validly ordained. In order for someone to be validly ordained, it must come from someone that can trace their ordination to the apostles

Hope that helps

In Christ


#9

Thank you all who have responded:thumbsup:
Sorry I have not been back on. The FBI agent that was killed today was very near where I live so it was a bit chaotic today.

Please pray that the man on the run is caught soon and that he hurts no one else. He is armed and dangerous. We are all keeping our doors locked and not letting the children play outside.

Ok back to the thread:o


#10

[LIST]
*]Bishop of Rome
*]Vicar of Christ
*]Successor of the Prince of the Apostles
*]Pontifex Maximus (the greatest bridge-builder)
*]Primate of Italy
*]Archbishop and Metropolitan of the Roman Province
*]Sovereign of the State of the Vatican City
*]Servant of the Servants of God
*]-]Patriarch of the West/-][/LIST]


#11

Hi

When you use internet explorer, pls pay attention to sidebar. You can see articles related, pdf or ppt file…you can find out your info.

Best regards


#12

[quote="ALLFORHIM, post:1, topic:69371"]
Hello All:wave:

3.) Is it said explicitly or implicitly or not at all that we are to follow one man on earth for complete guidance in understanding scripture.

[/quote]

3.) The Apostles all had different understandings of the Sacred Scriptures. They did not agree with each other about anything Christ taught them. And their views about most things Christian contradicted each other.

Of course this is not so. The Apostle all believed the same thing, - and had the same understanding of what Christ had taught them. Therefore one man, Peter, could lead the Apostles because whatever Peter thought and taught about Christianity was exactly what all of the Apostles and disciples thought and taught about Christianity.

St. Peter, the Pope, represents what Christianity is, as Christianity is united always in its beliefs. So, one man can and does lead the Church Christ established.


#13

This topic also is written in wikipedia and about.com.

You can find it by using Google.

If you want to do more info, pls visit at: IT job descriptions

Rgs


#14

[quote="ALLFORHIM, post:1, topic:69371"]
2.)Besides the one passage in Matthew--can you show me where in the bible we are suppose to follow Apostolic Succession or have One overall leader of the church?

[/quote]

One day Jesus of Nazareth was speaking with one of His select followers, one of The Twelve whome He called Apostles. The mans name was Simon bar Jonah, and He said: And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. [size=3]And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."
[/size]At another point Jesus gave Kephas (Peter in Latin) specific instructions as to his duties. Jesus said to him: "[size=3]lovest thou me more than these?"[/size] He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, "[size=3]Feed my lambs."[/size]
He saith to him again the second time, [size=3]Simon bar [/size][size=3]Jonah, lovest thou me?[/size] He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, "[size=3]Feed my sheep."[/size]
He saith unto him the third time, "[size=3]Simon bar [size=3][size=3]Jonah, lovest thou me?[/size][/size] He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that[/size][size=3], lovest thou me?"[/size] Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, "[size=3]Feed my sheep."[/size]
[size=3]"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry[/size][size=3]thee[/size][size=3]whither thou wouldest not."[/size]
This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, "[size=3]Follow me."[/size]

[size=2]The job description: From this we see that Jesus Christ gave full Apostolic Authority (The Keys of The Kingdom of Heaven) and that Authority would bind in Heaven what was bound on Earth and loose in Heaven what was loosed on Earth. All those present would have known, as it was in ancient Israel, that binding and loosing was given by the King (in Catholic Theology Jesus is the King of Kings and The Lord of Lords) to his designated Prime Minister to rule with the full Authority of The King until his return. Later, Jesus gave Peter the responsibility of care of His flock, i.e. The Church (feed my flock, feed my sheep) and the commandment to follow Him. Also in the Popes job description is to be the "Servant of the Servants of God."[/size]


#15

It might also be helpful to read some of the writings of the folks who were the direct followers of the Apostles. We call them the “Fathers of the Church”. You can Google search on that term and find tons of references. Some of their writings can be a bit dry. One book that I found very helpful and very readable is called “Four Witnesses: The Early Church in her own words.” It’s by Rod Bennett. He took four of the early Father’s and used their writing to weave a story. In it you see how the early church looked to Rome and the Bishop of Rome. Fascinating reading - a real page turner!


#16
  1. I think the words of Jesus to Peter in Luke 12:42 (and Matthew 24:45) suggest that in every age there should be one steward set over his master's (Jesus') household (Church), feeding them, until the master's (Jesus') return, beginning with Peter.

#17

WOW !!! out of the ashes - from apr 07 to apr 10.

Anyway, what gets me is that so many non-Catholics always start out by “where in the bible does it say such and such”. Yet, I have never heard a reply (just verses thrown out at random which don’t answer direct) of where in the bible does it say that EVERY doctrine must be in the Bible? Where in the Bible do we have a list of books that belong in the bible. I’m not talking about the index. Where in the bible does it say that the bible is the Bible?

Also what the did early Christians say around 110, 150, 200, etc use to point out question like the ones posed these days by non-Catholics such as “Where in the bible…” where there was no bible as we know it today?

Even after the bible was canonized how many bibles were printed (note:there was no printing press) and after the printing press was invented, how many people could actually read?

Also one more - where in the bible did Jesus command his apostles to go and write anything down?


#18

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