Sex outside of marriage is sinful, is it not?
Yes I agree every person’s situation is different and I am not labeling any particular persons situation because I can’t. That is for each individual to decide before God as we are all sinners and He loves everyone and wants us all in that state of grace and so calls us all to turn back to Him.
I am bowing out of this conversation, will mute this thread and will just leave with this article from Catholic Answers. It is long but explains things well.
How about, “Thou shall not commit adultery”?
We’re on to assisted suicide now? I’m told it’s now ‘death with dignity.’
The commonality to this entire discussion is that sin does not change from age to age or from culture to culture. Even though same-sex relations, sex outside of marriage, and now even assisted suicide are somewhat acceptable in our culture, in our time, doesn’t mean they’re not still sin.
And just because an action or behavior feels natural, or is normal according to the rest of a society, doesn’t mean it’s right and good, nor does it mean that the action or behavior is now ordered. All sex outside of the marriage between a man and a woman, and even sex inside that marriage in which the outcome of creating new life is blocked, is sin.
The Catholic Church might consider gay sex to be a sin which is a purely doctrinal statement, but that’s completely different from the unsubstantiated claim that it causes “physical and psychological harm”.
No, you’ve responded sufficiently to my question. Thanks.
Do you have any examples of such behavior in nature?
Homosexual behaviour in animals in natural conditions is directed towards survival of species
Exactly. I don’t need to debate about same sex “marriage” with the world. The world is fallen. There is no same sex “marriage” in the Catholic Church and never can be.
There is no same sex marriage on anywhere on the planet and never will be because marriage is by definition sacramental
Something being found in nature doesn’t equal it being natural. This seems to be a very common misconception, perhaps a modern heresy. Fr. Mike Schmitz has also called out this thinking. Some fish have 3 eyes, others have zero eyes because of chemicals and toxins pollutants… are we saying this is now natural?
God created man and woman in His image, He didn’t create animals in His image. Therefore, what is found in nature can not be applied to what is natural. It’s comparing apples and oranges, I’m sure the Pharisees would get a good kick out of it
It is indeed sacramental. I consider same sex “marriage” to be an anti-sacrament and a devilish imitation, no matter how many nations legalize it. Satan cannot create and he cannot ordain. He can only imitate and mock.
These are exactly the words Christopher West used in a recent 3 hour interview with Matt Fradd. He said ”The devil doesn’t have his own clay, he can only mock and twist what is already created.”
And this is not condemning those who partake in this, as Jesus came to call sinners not the righteous. Nobody is perfect and we all need mercy every day, we must love the sinner but condemn the sin
Homosexuality in animals is not caused by chemicals or toxins. For those who engage in homosexual behavior, it’s natural and normal for them to do it. Here’s what one article says about bonobos, a species of great ape closely related to humans:
These primates are so closely related to people that they share 98.7 percent of humans’ DNA. Along with chimpanzees, they are humans’ closest living relatives…
Homosexuality in bonobos is not cultural. When primatolgist Frans de Waal first saw the outlandish sexual acts of bonobos, other scientists remarked that the behavior must have arisen because those bonobos were locked in a zoo. But data gathered from the wild — and wild-born bonobos in captivity — over the past two decades has demonstrated that bonobo sexuality is just part of who they are.
Sex for fun in bonobos, and many other animals, plays a social function. There is stress-relief sex, make-up sex and random hook-up sex.
That’s mostly a Catholic idea. Protestants, including Lutherans, do not consider marriage to be a sacrament. And non-Christians don’t consider marriage to be a sacrament.
I would give you credit but Wikipedia isn’t a proven resource.
What do you mean by a “proven source”? The Wikipedia article has 125 footnotes, many of them to articles in scientific journals. Some of the footnotes even have links to these articles. It’s not very difficult to click on them and read the referenced articles.
When the Roman Catholic Church says a man and woman are validly married, then they are validly married. It doesn’t matter to me what other churches say or what the rest of the world says.
You are equating nature with natural and they aren’t even close to the same