What scriptures say animals won't go to heaven?


#1

Hello,

My understanding as a Creationist, drawing upon the Holy Scriptures, is that humans and animals have souls, but not plants. Never does God use the word “living”, “life”, “death”, “dying”, etc. to refer to plants. But uses “green things” (Job 39:8) and “withering”. That is another clue as to why humans and animals were able to eat plants before the fall of mankind, since death (sin, disease, suffering, etc.) did not enter into the world until after the sin of Adam and Eve.

answersingenesis.org/arti…/do-leaves-die
answersingenesis.org/arti…green-machines

As the Catholic church is open to creation science and animals being in heaven, i agree with both. In my understanding and belief, animals won’t be saved as humans will be saved, since animals cannot chose to sin, like humans (whom are in need to daily choose Jesus). But, since all of creation will one day be redeemed through Jesus Christ, i believe that will include animals. Just as Mary was full of grace and was still needing to be saved through the Cross (Luke 1:47), animals can be saved through the cross by no choice of their own (Romans 8:20-21).

I read on catholic.com that those animal souls that are bonded to human souls may be only the animals that go to heaven. Of course there is a lot of speculation…

What scriptures clearly state animals will not go to heaven?

God Bless You!

Brian


#2

It would be pretty awkward constantly running into animals that died so I could have their delicious bacon, steaks, and so forth.

“Oh heeeeey Bessie… no hard feelings?”


#3

Since you are almost Catholic, you should know that the Catholic Church does not see the Bible as a proof-text for its teachings. Rather, the Bible is a witness to the truths of the Church since the Church was founded by Christ and the Church wrote the NT and decided which of the OT books were to be included in the canon of Scripture.

Getting that out of the way, the Bible says nothing at all about the state of animals after death. Nor does it say anything about plants. The souls of animals are not immortal because they are not created in the image of God as human beings are. If they had immortal souls they would be subject to the laws of God and we would not be allowed to keep them for food and labor, as that would be unfair to other sentient creatures.

We do not know just what will occupy the new heavens and the new earth. We can only speculate. St. Paul was addressing the results of mortal sin but also saying that death and decay of the natural things around us, animals and plants, were set up by God but that when the new order comes even that will be abolished. He was not saying that animals have immortal souls.


#4

All living things have a soul, or they would not be living. It is just that three types of souls are recognized: Rational - human; sensitive - animals, and vegetative - plants.


#5

Our vernacular language also confesses this. We speak of the difference between animate (living) and inanimate (lifeless) things. Anima is the Latin word for soul. The prayer that begins, Anima Christi, sanctifica me translates to “Soul of Christ, sanctify me.”


#6

Well, it appears that there will be both bacteria and viruses in heaven then. :wink:

As to animals, even beloved pets, I simply cannot care. My love of God must trump the love of any created thing. We can withstand being in the presence of animals without harm. God’s presence is so infinitely stronger that we cannot survive it in a human state. To experience the beatific vision will be so profound, so intense, so riveting, that I seriously doubt that we will be concerned with anything else.

Nevertheless, God saves whomever and whatever He wills.


#7

In the Revelation it talks about Jesus and the armies of heaven riding on white horses at the end of the world. So there may be horses there.


#8

I never thought about there being horses in heaven! That would be really cool. Sometimes, I sit and wonder about resurrected bodies, glorified bodies and etc. Jesus, Mary and Elijah went to heaven body AND soul. So there will be some bodies up there and what else?


#9

Human Souls differ spiritually and remarkably different over Animal and Plants in that Human’s are the only creature’s on Earth, being Self-Aware whom can say to themselves, “I am; therefore I exist”. Animals and Plants do not possess this cognitive power.

Catholic Answers Apologist Michelle Arnold made a very good answer in this thread…
forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=53700


#10

Precisely, “rational” having to do with reason and logic.


#11

If God intends for animals in heaven, they would not be the same animals as here. He would just create some animals for heaven.

Fluffy may die, but there can still be cats in heaven.

Meningitis , but there can still be bacteria in heaven.

You may die, BUT IT WILL STILL BE YOU IN HEAVEN, for you live eternally in God.


#12

=GodHeals;8938551]Hello,

My understanding as a Creationist, drawing upon the Holy Scriptures, is that humans and animals have souls, but not plants. Never does God use the word "living", "life", "death", "dying", etc. to refer to plants. But uses "green things" (Job 39:8) and "withering". That is another clue as to why humans and animals were able to eat plants before the fall of mankind, since death (sin, disease, suffering, etc.) did not enter into the world until after the sin of Adam and Eve.

answersingenesis.org/arti.../do-leaves-die
answersingenesis.org/arti...green-machines

As the Catholic church is open to creation science and animals being in heaven, i agree with both. In my understanding and belief, animals won't be saved as humans will be saved, since animals cannot chose to sin, like humans (whom are in need to daily choose Jesus). But, since all of creation will one day be redeemed through Jesus Christ, i believe that will include animals. Just as Mary was full of grace and was still needing to be saved through the Cross (Luke 1:47), animals can be saved through the cross by no choice of their own (Romans 8:20-21).

I read on catholic.com that those animal souls that are bonded to human souls may be only the animals that go to heaven. Of course there is a lot of speculation...

What scriptures clearly state animals will not go to heaven?

God Bless You!

Brian

It's THERE if you are able to understand and accept it:shrug:

Here is a sample that comes to mind.

*Deut.30: 19 *"I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse; therefore choose life, that you and your descendants may live,"

Animals can't choose!

Here's a second one that just occurred to me:

Matt. 25: 31-39
"When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left. Then the King will say to those at his right hand, Come, O blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.' Then the righteous will answer him,Lord, when did we see thee hungry and feed thee, or thirsty and give thee drink? And when did we see thee a stranger and welcome thee, or naked and clothe thee? And when did we see thee sick or in prison and visit thee? Ect."

God Bless,
Pat


#13

To the OP. Animals and plants have souls, but they are material souls...in a sense. The hierarchy of souls is like this:
Humans - rational souls
Animals - sensory souls
Plants - nutritive souls

Each one in the hierarchy has the powers of the one below it. Our soul is said to be quite different due to will and intellect that humans have...both of which are immaterial qualities, unlike the material qualities of the other two types of souls.

Aquinas goes over this in quite a bit more detail.


#14

Thank you all for the postings! It was great to get your feedbacks.

Yes, it is true, i am almost Catholic, but my creationist view is accepted within the Catholic tradition. Some recent Catholic converts are creationists and their powerful stories are found here: kolbecenter.org/

I like www.answersingenesis.org even though it is protestant. Both the Kolbe center and AIG have MD and Doctors who do extensive scientific research in creationism.

St. Kolbe (a scientist), amongst many church fathers and leaders throughout the centuries hold to a creationist view. I am sure there are slight variations in the creationist views. But, i am not ashamed of, nor will i ever be, of my creationist views. I believe that God has revealed these truths to me, just as he gives faith, by grace, to all who choose Him.

I am not a sola scriptura person, not sure that i was ever, but was confused for many years. I love the Catholic moral teachings and most everything that the Catholic church stands for, but still have some questions...

I don't think it can be understood through reason that plants have souls, especially since scriptures never says so. Soul means to be living as is described to humans (Genesis 2:7) and animals (Genesis 1:20–25).

WHERE in the scriptures does it say that plants have souls?

How does one reason the animal soul is "immaterial"? Do we deduce this just because animals do not have memory, intellect, and a will as man? Just because they aren't saved, doesn't mean God won't put them in heaven. I need more study on this!

I guess we'll see in heaven if animals are there and trust that the Catholic Church doesn't comment for reason that She doesn't know for sure AS SOMEONE SUGGESTED IN THE OTHER THREAD. I would like to see the "The wolf will live with the lamb..."(Isaiah 11:6-9) .... perhaps, we can play with the DINOSAURS in Heaven : )


#15

I believe all living things have souls, right down to bacteria, and including plants. I think when we learn to quantum teleport, we'll get the proof then, since I'm convinced that for quite some time we will be able to teleport material items, but all living things will arrive dead as a doornail, since we won't be able to "quantise" the soul. As a sideline, it would be a good quarantine method, since every bug and insect on board would perish.

Early days yet, and at this stage, we're only doing it with photons

abc.net.au/news/2011-04-15/scientists-teleport-schrodingers-cat/2614780

What happens after death to animals we don't know. The question usually arises because we want to know what happens to our pets, whom we love so to speak.

Maybe lions join a state called "Lionhood" for example. Maybe our pets form a part of us, and live on in that way. But they have souls, or they wouldn't be alive.


#16

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Bob. So LIGHT was teleported? That seems interesting. I still don’t know where in the bible plants are given souls. Yes, I agree, animals have souls… but we have to remember, and as i understand it, before the fall, animals didn’t have fear and all got along with each other and with man, including the dinosaurs. God put fear into animals; yes, this includes dinosaurs.

“The fear and dread of you will fall on all the beasts of the earth, and on all the birds in the sky, on every creature that moves along the ground, and on all the fish in the sea; they are given into your hands.” - Genesis 9:2

Did you know that the BLUE WHALE living in our oceans today is TWICE THE SIZE of the LARGEST DINOSAUR that we have ever discovered? This should put into perspective that animals and Dinosaurs did live together as the earth is only 6500 or so years old.

Job spoke of Dinosaurs and there cave paintings, etc. that have been found of dinosaurs…

So much for the traditional Christmas Martyrology (which has been changed to be more “politically correct” to figure in so called evolution) at Midnight Mass. “The twenty-fifth day of December. In the five thousand one hundred and ninety-ninth year of the creation of the world…”


#17

All living things are animated by a spirit. “It is the spirit that gives life. The flesh avails nothing” (John 6:63) Pops into mind.

Animals cannot choose God. They are programmed with instinct. Think of them like AI with flesh.

Prophecy teaches principle rather than precision. Wolf and lamb may be metaphors.


#18

I agree animals only have instinct and souls, but still in Genesis, we never read plants have a soul, but only humans and animals. I don't like people using the argument that you cannot take Genesis literal. I think current creation science accounts for more a better account of God's creation. If we cannot take it literal, how do we know what else isn't to be taken literal. That is why i think the church doesn't say definitively one way or another...

When i cut the grass, i don't think i am cutting down souls. Grass are GREEN THINGS that come up from the earth, which are both biblical uses of the language used to describe plants... Plants never die, but wither... because they were never alive.


#19

[quote="GodHeals, post:18, topic:273067"]
I agree animals only have instinct and souls, but still in Genesis, we never read plants have a soul, but only humans and animals. I don't like people using the argument that you cannot take Genesis literal. I think current creation science accounts for more a better account of God's creation. If we cannot take it literal, how do we know what else isn't to be taken literal. That is why i think the church doesn't say definitively one way or another...

When i cut the grass, i don't think i am cutting down souls. Grass are GREEN THINGS that come up from the earth, which are both biblical uses of the language used to describe plants... Plants never die, but wither... because they were never alive.

[/quote]

If a plant has no spirit, it cannot live. The spirit is the motivator of all life, and all of life's actions within a living thing. And, plants are most certainly a living thing.

If a plant has no spirit, how does a Venus flytrap catch insects? Why do all plants, including giant Sequoias, follow the sun?


#20

“I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war.” - Revelation 19:11

I agree animals only have instinct and souls, but still in Genesis, we never read plants have a soul, but only humans and animals. I don’t like people using the argument that you cannot take Genesis literal. I think current creation science accounts for more a better account of God’s creation. If we cannot take it literal, how do we know what else isn’t to be taken literal. That is why i think the church doesn’t say definitively one way or another…

When i cut the grass, i don’t think i am cutting down souls. Grass are GREEN THINGS that COME UP from the earth, which is biblical language to describe plants… Plants never die, but WITHER… because they were never alive.


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