I believe they should be denied communion and ex-communicated.
I suppose that when you’re perfect, that looks like an eminantly reasonable position. Unfortunately the first requirement for membership in the Church is that the person be a sinner. It must be lonely at the summit of the mountain.
What happened to “let him who has no sin cast the first stone”? Lets show mercy and love as we have been shown mercy and love!
Excommunication shows that they’re never welcome back- and that’s not true. They’re always welcome back so long as they repent. But people who have fallen away probably don’t understand ‘excommunication’ and any big measures taken by the Church will be seen as hateful acts and non-loving acts, something they will never come back to.
If they are insist that they **rather obey the needs of society **than that taught by the Church which Jesus Christ founded, then should be denied Holy Communion, or execommunicated. If they feel that what they have done is wrong, they should repent and change their ways.
The last time I check, we aren’t suppose to “Do it My Way.” Jesus is the Way. He is the Head of the Church, so when the Church speaks concerning moral and faith, we are to remain obedient.
Burn Them! Burn them all! errr, I mean Pray, pray for them all.
Seriously, I was a dissenter at one time. Fortunately I feel I was “trained up right” as a child, and returned only because of prayer, and the Holy Spirit. It is, however, a very slow process. Pray, hope, and don’t worry. (Padre Pio)
If you are excomunicated you can never repent and come back to the Church? While I agree with the point that dissenters probably do not understand the excomunication (or for that matter the Church entirely otherwise they would not be dissenters) I think that it is time that people start doing what they believe in and believe in what they do. Christ did not have patience for people who did not want to follow him right away. Right NOW. Following does not mean a life without sin it means a life of trying and dissenters to me means people who are not trying to follow they are trying to lead.
Actually, excommunication is a great act of mercy with the hope that the offender will come back. It can always be absolved. Holy Mother Church never “gives up” on her children.
Apart from the rare cases in which excommunication is imposed for a fixed period and then ceases of itself, it is always removed by absolution. It is to be noted at once that, though the same word is used to designate the sacramental sentence by which sins are remitted and that by which excommunication is removed, there is a vast difference between the two acts.
The absolution which revokes excommunication is purely jurisdictional and has nothing sacramental about it. It reinstates the repentant sinner in the Church; restores the rights of which he had been deprived, beginning with participation in the sacraments; and for this very reason, it should precede sacramental absolution, which it thenceforth renders possible and efficacious.
After absolution from excommunication has been given in foro externo, the judge sends the person absolved to a confessor, that his sin may be remitted; when absolution from censure is given in the confessional, it should always precede sacramental absolution, conformably to the instruction in the Ritual and the very tenor o the formula for sacramental absolution, It may be noted at once that the principal effect of absolution from excommunication may be acquired without the excommunicated person’s being wholly reinstated in his former position. Thus, an ecclesiastic might not necessarily recover the benefice which he had lost; indeed he might be admitted to lay communion only. Ecclesiastical authority has the right to posit certain conditions for the return of the culprit, and every absolution from excommunication calls for the fulfilment of certain conditions which vary in severity, according to the case
Kill 'em all and let God sort it out…
Exactly Enoch thank you for clearing that up for me. I think we are missing the point that people excomunicate themselves when they preach or act against the Church.
When I was Protestant, we used to hold Prayer Vigils.
Prayer Vigils lasted for hours, sometimes days. There were several ways to do it, but usually we committed to a time slot to pray for the need, and in that way, there was constant prayer by a large group of people being offered up to the Lord for a long period of time.
I suggest we try this in our Catholic churches for those who known as dissenters.
And then follow it up by asking each prayer warrior to write a letter or send a card to the dissenter letting him/her know that we have been praying for him/her to see the truth in the Catholic Church teachings.
It’s just a thought. Prayer changes things.
I have to admit, I wish we could just kick 'em out, but then they would just become Protestant. The Bible says we shouldn’t repay evil with evil. I think we should take care of our own dissenters rather than hoisting them off on some other church!
I like the idea of praying for then, especially if it is done during the Prayers of the Faithful.
Those who openly oppose or deny Church Teaching should be denied Communion. Otherwise they are eating their own condemnation and it is not a kindness if this is not made clear to them.
Your right start with all the “Liberal Unborn Children”. Let’s force abortion on everyone of them:D
Hey, ya’ll, let’s not get violent here, OK? It doesn’t accomplish anything good, does it?
I think that we would accomplish more with love than with a sword (or an abortionist’s suction device).
Prayer. And probably fasting, too. And loving letters. :gopray:
Are we talking Heresy or lack of full communion with the church?
Which violations are we talking about? Just wondering. There is a difference in the levels of disobedience…
I was joking. Dissention is good for the church. Keeps it on it’s toes. Is it possible that the Holy Spirit can move people to promote positve change? Are we not all part of the same body?
When the foot feels pain, does it not tell the brain? The church needs to listen to all her children:)
I completely agree- either be in or be out. But they need to know that Jesus forgives, and so do we, and if they decide to follow Him, they are always welcome back.
I was disapointed that “Burn them at the stake” was not a choice. Just kidding, of course.
Seriously, they do need to repent. However, I think excommunication is a tool, that is under-utilized, to help people understand the seriousness of their error.
All dissenters, especially the ones who infuriate us the most, whether they be theologians, priests, bishops, cardinals, or our neighbor in the next pew, all deserve our prayers.
Just as we hope they are praying for us!
There is legitimate dissent, and then there is heresy and apostasy. A priest, may, for example, arguing for a married priesthood. This is not a a doctrine but a discipline so he can legitimately dissent with the Church. The priest, however, cannot **act **on that dissenting view and go out and marry a woman without facing serious canonical penalties.
Disagreeing with Church teaching on female priestesses is not topic of legitimate dissent. It is a matter of doctrine and so cannot change. So insisting on this separates someone from Holy Mother Church.****