What to do when the law doesn't help!


#1

I have two sisters that are divorced and both are being harassed by their ex-husbands. I live in Florida and don't know if it is just Florida that has weak laws to protect women and children or if this is nation why, but I am angry.

I have written plenty on my one sister who has an ex who is a cop and he abuses the children physically and just yesterday he kidnapped his son again from the sister and again the law can do nothing. But I will not write about her, but I ask for prayers for her and her two children. Her situation is a mess.

I have another sister whose ex is really scaring me, moreso than my other sister's ex. This sister is just divorced one year. Her ex is the one who wanted the divorce for he found another woman, but when that woman left him and after the divorce, he decided he wanted his wife back. It was too late for my sister did not want him back. He is obsessed with her. He texts, calls and comes by her house many times. He upsets her so much that he cusses at her and he calls this love. He does all this to get her back, but is pushing her away for now she wants nothing to do with him and sees how unstable he really is. She has now found another man. The problem is that this man is not yet divorce. So her ex has used this against her and has tried to call me and has even approached my dad and told him. He is doing everything possible to make her life a living hell. The man she is seeing has a wife who is mentally unstable and crazy. She has told her ex to be careful of this woman and he goes right around and gives this woman my sister's cell phone number and house number. This woman calls my sister at least 10-20 times a day and leaves messages like, "You are stealing my husband, don't worry I will take care of your children." My sister is afraid for her kids and what this woman will do to them. She has called the police and told them of these calls and her threats. She has told them of her ex's many calls, texts, and visits and nothing can be done. They gave her a log to fill out of the calls, text and etc he and this crazy woman do so that she can if it becomes too many present it to a judge. She could at that time say they are harrassing her, but they are doing that now. What is wrong with the law?:shrug: My sister is crying everyday. She can't even enjoy her Christmas. I have emailed her ex and told him to back off and he has tried calling me twice, but unfortunately both times I was unable to accept the calls, otherwise I would have talked to him. I tried calling him back, but he won't accept my calls now.

My sister finally talked to his parents and told them of their son's weird, controlling, and obsessive behavior, but they are in denial. She even told him how he said to her and to my dad and to one other person that over his dead body that this man she is dating or any other man was going to father his sons. He said he had nothing to lose anymore. His parents didn't know what that meant. They asked my sister what that meant. They are in their late 80's and she did not want to hurt them anymore, so she just said that he is acting weird and is going to allow them to think about it and they will figure it out.

I am concerned for my sister's safety for this ex doesn't seem to care if he lives or dies and the law can't do anything unless he makes the first more. Well his first move could be the end of her life. Why do they have to wait for that? Anyone had an experience like this and what do you recommend? My sister doesn't know if she should go and buy a gun and learn how to use it. That is how afraid she is.

Please any advice. Yes, I know my sister is committing adultery and I have told her so. There is nothing I can do about that. She is not Catholic and only reads the Bible maybe about 5 minutes a day if that. I was so disappointed in her when I found out myself. We were brought up so different then this.:(


#2

Florida’s laws are tougher than many states. She can get an injunction that her harassers can ignore, and it will probably provoke them. When they violate the order she has options to have them prosecuted, It also shows a pattern of disregarding the law if the worst happens and she has to defend herself. But, since florida is a shall issue state, assuming she doesn’t have a criminal record or a mental deficiency she can get a permit to carry a concealed weapon.

But at the same time she does that she must move. The farther the better. Her kids are at risk if she keeps this up, her duty is to them. She needs to dump the guy, now. She needs to get someplace where it is harder for her ex to get in touch with her.


#3

So her Ex left her for another woman…

Now she is someone else’s other woman…

Does she not see the irony and cruelty of that?

She needs to dump the guy and move. Change her cell phone number - the whole works.


#4

[quote="nana3, post:1, topic:223676"]
I have two sisters that are divorced and both are being harassed by their ex-husbands. I live in Florida and don't know if it is just Florida that has weak laws to protect women and children or if this is nation why, but I am angry.

[/quote]

since you don't state what legal steps either of your sisters have taken, I cannot comment.


#5

[quote="styrgwillidar, post:2, topic:223676"]
Florida's laws are tougher than many states. She can get an injunction that her harassers can ignore, and it will probably provoke them. When they violate the order she has options to have them prosecuted, It also shows a pattern of disregarding the law if the worst happens and she has to defend herself. But, since florida is a shall issue state, assuming she doesn't have a criminal record or a mental deficiency she can get a permit to carry a concealed weapon.

But at the same time she does that she must move. The farther the better. Her kids are at risk if she keeps this up, her duty is to them. She needs to dump the guy, now. She needs to get someplace where it is harder for her ex to get in touch with her.

[/quote]

She does live far from her ex. In fact it was him that moved far so that he could make her life even more difficult by making her drive the kids to his house even though the divorce papers say he is suppose to pick them up at school or her house. HE won't do it. She consulted her attorney and she said the judge would find this silly and say that they should be able to work this out, so the attorney told her to drive her boys to his house and so she goes an hour to drive them to his house. He used that time to harrass her, so now she has my niece, who is 24 yr old to take the kids to his house. He is not to happy about that, but she is avoiding him as much as possible.


#6

[quote="Catholic90, post:3, topic:223676"]
So her Ex left her for another woman....

Now she is someone else's other woman......

Does she not see the irony and cruelty of that?

She needs to dump the guy and move. Change her cell phone number - the whole works.

[/quote]

Two of us sisters and my mom have told her to leave this man. I was more kinder to her except to tell her that she was committing adultery. One of my sister told her that now she is the other woman and since that is the other sister mentioned in this thread also and who was also betrayed by her ex, she told this sister to leave this man alone for she doesn't know if he could still reconcile with his wife and it is not fair to her and she has two small kids as well. So yes, we have been firm with her but she is in love, I guess and refusing to listen. I agree that she needs to dump this guy and because she is refusing her life right now is a living hell and it will get worse for the man she is involved with has a wife who is not willing to give up her husband so easily. The husband says she is crazy, but we only have his word for it. My sister's ex who is also acting crazy lately had proof, police reports, made against my sister's lover. He sounds aggressive. When my sister defends him, she makes excuses for all his actions. He has shoved this wife, just as her husband did to her and she knows that is wrong and domestic violence. One time his wife would not allow him into his house to pick up his things when he moved out into his condo and he just knocked downt he front door and she called the police. He did not have to do that. He could have done what my other sister's ex did on his second wife and that is call the police and simply state that this house is still yours and you want your possession. My sister doesn't see he has a violent temper too. She is blind to it. Thank God her boys have not met this man yet. They know about him but that is the ex's fault for he told them about him. The ex sees women, many of them and the boys see that.

Anyway, my sister is one that likes things friendly and divorce is not and I think she is seeing that now. I don't know what she has gotten involved with a married man. We were not raised this way. The rest of us sisters are shocked!:(


#7

Puzzleannie, I thought you were one who commented on my first sister’s situation,but I could be wrong. It is too long to explain here, but the legal steps she has taken: 1: reports to child services of child abuse and neglect (about 7 of them and not all made by her)–ignored by the law. 2: calls to the police when her ex kidnapped her kids and since the ex and wife (at the time) were both cops and the cops who responded worked where the wife worked again nothing was done and she was told to contact her lawyer. 3: many times going before the judge with psychologist, three in fact, and all three said the father should have supervised visitation and the judge ignored it 4: with this same judge guardian ad litem was asked for to protect the kids judge denied it 5: with the same judge parenting classes and parenting coordinator asked for and the judge denied it for the other side said why involve a third party. 6: restraining order was placed on ex and his wife after one of the abuses on the kids and my sister refused to give him the kids for one summer and in court the restraining order was found unfounded and the ex took her to court for being in contempt because she did not give him the kids in the summer and the judge found her in contempt. 7: He was in contempt in many things from not paying child support, medical bills and judge was again on his side. 8: the ex refused to take kids to counseling appt. and stopped it by court order and my sister had to go to court for it again and won this time, but the kids were out of counseling for 6 months. He did this for the kids were talking about what he was doing to them.

So that is all my first sister has done with her ex and she is still having problems with her ex. He has now brainwashed his son yet again for he now is saying he doesn’t need to go to his Healing Tree counseling appts. which are for sexually abused kids which he was by his dad’s ex two years ago, but you see the dad is in denial and doesn’t think that happened either. The dad is not giving his son on his visitation time the necessary psychiatric medication to his son for he refuses to acknowledge his son has a mental problem. So you see how my sister has problems with this man. He leaves her text messages and tells her when he is coming to pick up the kids without calling her first before hand. She makes medicals appt. for them. He doesn’t care. He is mean to her on the phone when they talk. For her it has been going on for six years.

As far as my second sister, I believe she is causing her own problems, except that her ex is at fault for calling and texting her too much. That is harrassment. Her attorney did say that if he keeps it up, she can put a restraining order on him and the woman who keeps calling her, but she has to keep a call log first. In other words, she needs proof and I believe it for my sister mentioned aboved did not have proof and that is why the judge found it unfounded and dismissed it even though in the courtroom, they, the ex and his wife, were harrassing her with their looks and making eyes at her and smiling at her to the point that a correction officer had to correct them and told them to stop looking( in a mocking way) in her direction. So yes, they were harrassing her, but she had no proof, so my second sister needs proof before she goes in. One idea I had is to tell her ex that from now on when he calls her and when she is talking to him on the phone to tell him that the call is being recorded. We have to by law let him know that calls are being recorded. If he harrasses her on the recorded call, she can use that as evidence for he knew it was being recorded, but she also has many messages he has left too on her voicemail too, especially from the woman of her lover. So to answer your question this sister has made no legal action so far.


#8

Look Florida can be a rough state. My "issue" was in Florida. I got a temporary restraining order. He wasn't happy so he walked in to the courthouse 10 minutes from close and got a temporary restraining order based on lies and my medical history at the Dept of VA (oh no I was on meds for depression - thats how treat soldiers - punish them for getting help - btw not on them anymore - got cleared and don't need to be) to get one slapped on me. So the police came and picked up my gun and all I was left with was a useless piece of paper. I ended up taking him back because I felt like I had no support from the community. We both dropped our restraining orders. The second time I went though it and the police asked me why I had not gotten a restraining order I told them that much - they told me I was better with a firearm. I had six police reports in one week - every single one of them was something the police felt was right on the line of legal or they would not be able to prove was him. I left town with what fit into my car and moved into my parents basement because I was scared for my life.

Now I am 2000 miles away - the court put a basic no harassment order on both of us after my realtor found him in the house that was only in my name (this was the courts was of not assigning fault but protecting my assets from being sold) and the police would not file a report even though he had to break in. Right before Christmas he broke the no harassment order by his billing address changed to mine so for a nice Christmas present I got to be slapped in the face with thisremnder of the fact that I am going through a divorce.

So my point is your sister needs a good lawyer. Preferably one that deals with issues such a domestic violence as this type of lawyer will understand stalking behavior as well. You would do well to get her that and then get out of the situation - the more people talking about it - the worse makes it. (MInus the shoulder to cry on)

She should not be dating. One thing that saved me in this is that when my husband started running around town telling everyone I was cheating - no one believed him. Even people that had only met me once or twice. Granted Florida is a no-fault state as far as the divorce but judges are human and they want good people raising children. Also it is better to be the blameless victim than to be playing "War of the Roses." If you haven't seen the movie it is a must see although graphic for those consiering divorce


#9

[quote="joandarc2008, post:8, topic:223676"]
Look Florida can be a rough state. My "issue" was in Florida. I got a temporary restraining order. He wasn't happy so he walked in to the courthouse 10 minutes from close and got a temporary restraining order based on lies and my medical history at the Dept of VA (oh no I was on meds for depression - thats how treat soldiers - punish them for getting help - btw not on them anymore - got cleared and don't need to be) to get one slapped on me. So the police came and picked up my gun and all I was left with was a useless piece of paper. I ended up taking him back because I felt like I had no support from the community. We both dropped our restraining orders. The second time I went though it and the police asked me why I had not gotten a restraining order I told them that much - they told me I was better with a firearm. I had six police reports in one week - every single one of them was something the police felt was right on the line of legal or they would not be able to prove was him. I left town with what fit into my car and moved into my parents basement because I was scared for my life.

Now I am 2000 miles away - the court put a basic no harassment order on both of us after my realtor found him in the house that was only in my name (this was the courts was of not assigning fault but protecting my assets from being sold) and the police would not file a report even though he had to break in. Right before Christmas he broke the no harassment order by his billing address changed to mine so for a nice Christmas present I got to be slapped in the face with thisremnder of the fact that I am going through a divorce.

So my point is your sister needs a good lawyer. Preferably one that deals with issues such a domestic violence as this type of lawyer will understand stalking behavior as well. You would do well to get her that and then get out of the situation - the more people talking about it - the worse makes it. (MInus the shoulder to cry on)

She should not be dating. One thing that saved me in this is that when my husband started running around town telling everyone I was cheating - no one believed him. Even people that had only met me once or twice. Granted Florida is a no-fault state as far as the divorce but judges are human and they want good people raising children. Also it is better to be the blameless victim than to be playing "War of the Roses." If you haven't seen the movie it is a must see although graphic for those consiering divorce

[/quote]

Thanks for your advice. It sounds like you know Florida well. We have all adviced my sister to stop dating this man, but she won't listen. Her ex is already spreading rumors that she had an affair with this man before their divorce and while they were still married. She is very hurt by this, but I told her to stop seeing this man so that he has nothing to talk about, but she told me that he doesn't control her life. What can I do, she is an adult? I will pray for her. Yesterday her back went out and she had to go to the ER. I offered up her pain and suffering up and united it with Christ for her own conversion.

Thanks for sharing your story and I am sorry you had to go through all that. I hope my sister won't have to for she has two small children. Her ex could get her on kidnapping if she went into hiding with them.


#10

If I were you, I would report the child abuse to Child Protective Services. If you do that, something will almost definitely be done. But don’t do it out of vengeance or anything, do it out of concern for the children.


#11

[quote="nana3, post:9, topic:223676"]
Thanks for your advice. It sounds like you know Florida well. We have all adviced my sister to stop dating this man, but she won't listen. Her ex is already spreading rumors that she had an affair with this man before their divorce and while they were still married. She is very hurt by this, but I told her to stop seeing this man so that he has nothing to talk about, but she told me that he doesn't control her life. What can I do, she is an adult? I will pray for her. Yesterday her back went out and she had to go to the ER. I offered up her pain and suffering up and united it with Christ for her own conversion.

Thanks for sharing your story and I am sorry you had to go through all that. I hope my sister won't have to for she has two small children. Her ex could get her on kidnapping if she went into hiding with them.

[/quote]

I am sharing this statement with you - on the last page you will find a list of domestic violence resources:

USCCB Statement - "When I Call For Help"

I am going back for my Masters - Right now I plan on my masters project setting up a Catholic organization that answers this statement - please pray for this intention.


#12

Sometimes when your not living right (like living in adultry as your sister is) you open the door to all kinds of troubles. She has by her actions turned herself away from the Lord and His help. Her first task is to straighten out her own way of living(give up the married man). Then the Lord will be able to be more active in her life and show her what she needs to do to resolve her problems.

As for your other sister, restraining orders are fairly easy to get, she must go to her local police station and file for one.


#13

[quote="Holly3278, post:10, topic:223676"]
If I were you, I would report the child abuse to Child Protective Services. If you do that, something will almost definitely be done. But don't do it out of vengeance or anything, do it out of concern for the children.

[/quote]

8 to 9 child abuses reports have been files already on these people, the father and the step mom at the time. The worse being two physical abuses and the sexual molestations. DCF, what se call them here in Florida, did nothing. These are two cops that know the symptom. The stepmom works for DCF and changed the words of my nephew around and said the abuses were coming from my parents and my sister. I went to the examination with my nephew when he was examined by DCF doctors after one physical abuse which involved a belt mark across his back. The mark was still there a week later when the doctors saw him. My nephew told him how it happened and how they step on his face and chest with their shoes if he misbehaves for he has behavior problems and is on psychiatric medication,but they denied that too and said he needed harsh discipline,but that did not work as they say. The doctors saw how thin he was for they did not feed him and he had to look in the pantry and feed himself and he told him this. The doctors final report was physical abuse and neglect yet the judge who looked over his case and the pictures let it go and when we asked why, this was their answer: "Yes, it was physical abuse, but it was not at the level of abuse that we are use to seeing it so we are going to let it go for now." Can you believe that? So I asked the woman if it took my nephew to be in the hospital or being kidnapped, for his dad would not watch him either when he was out at stores but gave him freedom to roam starting at the age of 7, and she told me yes that is what it will take. I told her that was stupid and too late for the child. She said that is how the system worked here in our county. I went to her superiors and they said the same. It is just sickening. Kids have no rights to protect him here. It was shortly after that incident that my nephew was sexually molested. It would not have happened if they did their jobs. The justice system here is no good. From what we have seen not only with my sister but other mothers, it is the same.

So it would do not good to report it. The last people to report neglect to DCF was my nephew's good for the dad was not giving him his medications. DCF again did nothing. :mad:


#14

[quote="m_crane, post:12, topic:223676"]
Sometimes when your not living right (like living in adultry as your sister is) you open the door to all kinds of troubles. She has by her actions turned herself away from the Lord and His help. Her first task is to straighten out her own way of living(give up the married man). Then the Lord will be able to be more active in her life and show her what she needs to do to resolve her problems.

I agree with you totally.

As for your other sister, restraining orders are fairly easy to get, she must go to her local police station and file for one.

[/quote]

Here she can't get a restraining order for he is not persay harassing her but more being a neglectful father. He is not giving the medication to his son. He is not feeding his son when he has him on visitaton, for he feeds himself and he eats poptarts. He also keeps his son up way to late like 3 am and this messes him up when my sister gets him and he gets really angry for the teachers on Mondays. The school is noting all of this, but we don't know if they will ever go to court. The dad also did not take his son to a Healing Tree meeting or counseling appt. when he had him on visitation just because the son said he didn't feel like going. That was important for he was molested and this is a group counseling that helps him. The father is just unfit and when he wants his way he sends nasty texts to my sister saying he is going to pick up his son. He has lost his daughter who is 14. She doesn't has to go with him and doesn't.


#15

Wow.

The situation is so complex, I won't even try to address the whole thing.

The only advice I have is that your sisters may want to avoid their ex's as much as possible. The one who drives her son to the dad's for visitation may want to look into a third party exchange, at a neutral location, like a store parking lot. She could ask her lawyer to contact his lawyer and ask about this.

They should also change their phone numbers as someone already suggested, and make sure that the kids have cell phones to call home of they need to while at visitations. If they continue to call her, she should not answer her phone (caller ID is a must) and keep all voicemail and texts. She should never return their calls or respond to texts, that makes it look like she's engaging with these people, or egging them on.

Here in my county in the northeast, the District Attorneys office has a Domestic Violence Unit, separate from the police department. If her DA's office has a similar unit, she may want to reach out to them and ask their advice.

And lastly, your sister who has a boyfriend with a "crazy" wife-- she is putting her children in a terrible situation. Perhaps she thinks she is on "love" but rather than telling her she is committing adultery, perhaps someone should tell her she is harming her kids by having unstable people in their lives. It is imperative that she lose this man, and keep this woman out of all of their lives. As long as she keeps company with this man, the wife will loom in the background. There are other fish in the sea, she doesn't need one with the "crazy ex."


#16

Frankly, no, I can’t believe that. Who said it? The judge? When? In the courtroom? Did you hear this yourself, or did someone tell you?

I wouldn’t let that lie. If the judge or lawyer said “Yes, he is being abused, but we are not going to act,” I would be filing complaints up the ladder, until I got to the Supreme Court. That’s outrageous.


#17

[quote="StJudePray4Me, post:16, topic:223676"]
Frankly, no, I can't believe that. Who said it? The judge? When? In the courtroom? Did you hear this yourself, or did someone tell you?

I wouldn't let that lie. If the judge or lawyer said "Yes, he is being abused, but we are not going to act," I would be filing complaints up the ladder, until I got to the Supreme Court. That's outrageous.

[/quote]

Yes, I heard it myself and I also read it in the DCF report that my sister's lawyer now has in her possession. IN that report it clearly says, "child abuse to the child by his father and neglect." When my sister and I called the man in charge for I was listening on the other line, he said it "did not reach the level of child abuse that they are use to seeing." I know it outrageous and it was to us when we heard it, but that is what he said, so the father continues to be a bad father to this kid. The worse for now is not giving him the medications and we have to tell this 11 year old now to be responsible to remember the time of day he needs to take his medication for his dad does not. It is rediculous. When he is with his dad and he has a mental health appt. his dad won't take him to it and convinces the boy he doesn't need to go. That is what he does that is so wrong. Just this weekend he came back from his dad and had a full rage attack. He was punchind and kicking the couch. He picked up the phone and called his dad and said he was tired of everyone on our side of the family talking bad about him and saying he was brainwashing him. No one has mentioned that word. My sister grabbed the phone and asked him if he gave him the medicatons on time for this is how he acts when he doesn't take his medication and she knows that. HE of course said yes. She hung up and then the father called again a little later to speak to his son, but my nephew yelled out, " I don't want any more of his 'BS!" My sister asked him if he heard that and he said yes and hung up. This is how he comes back from his visitation with his father every other weekend. It is sad to see how he will never improve until his dad is out of the picture. My nephew was also very upset for they took him to another church. He asked his asked his dad if it was a sin for him to be in another religion and his dad said no, but he told his mom it felt wrong. His mom told him he had no choice for he did not know how to drive a car and it was not his sin. That bothered him a lot.

I guess we just pray for him for right now there is nothing that can be done.


#18

I wanted to thank those who responded to this thread and have offered prayers for my sisters. I have some more shocking and disappointing news. I almost did not want to believe it myself, for I don't want my nephew to go through anymore trauma.

I am know talking about my sister who has been divorced for about 6 years and has a son and daughter. The son who is in the special needs school for kids with behavioral problems and who may have bipolar disorder and who is in a Healing Tree program due to sexual molestation from his stepmom. Well, before Christmas and lately, he has been going more often into a rage. He told my sister two days ago that a boy on the bus has been molesting him and making him take off his pants. My sister did not know if this was true of not, but because he has been through this before, she mentioned it to the school and when he had group therapy today, sure enough, he disclosed it. They took him aside privately and he broke down in tears and said more than what he told to my sister. This boys has molested him on more than one occassion and not just on the bus. The other boy is the same age as my nephew and also has been sexually molested and physically abused as well, but has more mental health problems. He is more troubled. Anyway, the school reported the incident to child services or DCF and they came out to talk to my nephew tonight. My sister was not home tonight for she was with her daughter but my older niece was babysiting and she heard all that my nephew disclosed to the worker and she said it was disgusting what this other boy did to our nephew. She told my sister and my sister said it may her nauseous and she wanted to throw up. The DCF worker talked to my sister tonight and said that she talked to the other boy and his parents and they have concluded that my nephew was the one telling the truth and the other boy was lying. He was claiming my nephew was the attacker. My sister asked her how do they know and she told them they have training in knowing how a kids is lying. Anyway, this is a serious event and this other little boy is going to put in juvenile prison. My sister did not like that for he has mental health issues and because of his past as well, but DCF said they are the ones who are filing the criminal charges against this boy. It is a sad situation, but a reality. My nephew's life is yet ruin again my another act of violation of his privacy. My sister and the DCF worker asked my nephew why did he now report this sooner and he said the boy threatened him with his life. He was scared and he remembered his stepmom words again. Needless to say, I am asking you to pray for this little boy. The dad was told of this situation. Of course, he did not think of it as a big deal. He thinks his son will be okay. He is still in denial that the first molestation occurred, but he will have to face that this one occurred for charges are pending on this boy. Please pray for my nephew. He is really a broken soul. I saw him today and he was so full of anger when he got off the bus. The school has prohibited him from riding the bus until they decide on what is going to happen with the other boy. Tomorrow my sister is suppose to go down to the police station and file charges against this boy with DCF. Pray for this little boy also, he needs love and prayers also. He is also a victim. I don't think he knows what he has done.


#19

Praying for the entire family....


#20

[quote="joandarc2008, post:19, topic:223676"]
Praying for the entire family....

[/quote]

Thank you, please for my nephew on this Monday for he has to retell his story all over again and have a complete physical that the Department of Children and Family (DCF) does in case they want to prosecute the little boy and his stepmom for now he is telling more of what his step mom has done to him.

I have invited my sister and her children to a Holy Hour this week that a local Catholic Church is doing all week for Respect Life. It is a 9 day Eucharistic Novena for Respect Life, but I told her it would be good for her famly to go in those two weeks. I hope she will go with her kids. I can only pray. I was a messenger and gave her the message. The rest is up to her.


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