What's the best argument for Catholicism?


#1

Is there a best argument for Catholicism? If so what is it? I just wish i could “prove” Catholicism in one nice 15 minutes or less argument. I mean, I know Catholicism is true, but that’s based on everything I’ve learned about the Church in the past, which is quite a bit, i couldn’t even begin to summarize it into a nice clean argument, cuz every point depends on everything else. I wouldn’t know where to start!! I’m just curious what other people thought about this.


#2

You can’t prove it. The best argument is your own belief in her, although that may not do much to convince others who don’t otherwise consider you an impartial religious authority. One point a non-Catholic once made to me many years ago while I was into seriously doubting my Catholicism, is that the Catholic Church is the one with direct traceability to Jesus. True it may have done wrong things in the past and God knows she still has internal problems, but she’s the same Church.

Alan


#3

Hi.

One of the things I have done is learn Bible typology. If one can show, quickly and efficiently, how Scripture foreshadows a Church with the characteristics of the Catholic Church, in a very short time, one can leave an impression which makes the listener think later about the Church.

Things like this…

“The Nativity story in Luke is not just a story about Jesus’ birth. It’s a picture of the coming of our Savior Whose actual sacrificed body would become our FOOD in Communion, the central sacrament of the Church. The story says that Jesus was born in ‘Bethlehem,’ Hebrew for ‘House of Bread.’ Then the story tells us that when He was born Jesus was wrapped in swaddling clothes and laid in a manger. Notice that, wrapped in swaddling clothes, Jesus looks like a dead body wrapped in a shroud. And a manger is a feeding trough. So, instead of BREAD on a serving plate in ‘the House of Bread,’ we see THE BODY OF SACRIFICED JESUS on a kind of ‘serving plate’ in the ‘the House of Bread.’ The whole Bible is like that! Even the Jewish books of the Old Testament, written before Christ came!”

“For example, Adam, in the story of Adam and Eve, is a ‘picture’ who foreshadows Jesus! So, when God the Father is imposing sentence for the Original Sin in the Garden of Eden, He tells Adam, ‘Thorns and thistles shall it bring forth to you!’ That’s a prophecy of the Crown of Thorns. But then God says, ‘By the sweat of your face shall you get bread to eat!’ That’s a prophecy referring to the bloody sweat of Jesus during His agony in the garden, as He contemplated what was about to happen. Notice that He was earning ‘bread to eat’ – Roman Catholic Eucharist! – by that sweat.”

That kind of prophecy shakes ME up, and makes ME think twice!

Also, do not neglect “the prayer experiment,” especially if your listener is a young person. Tell them, “Look, God is sitting up there WAITING to answer your prayers! And praying WORKS EVERY TIME! If you have some problem, say a single prayer on the problem, then go do something else! I swear to you that you will get an answer. Maybe not the answer which you think you need, but you will get an answer. And when you do get your answer, God will make my prediction jump into your mind. If you look at God’s answer, it will turn out to be better than what you prayed for!”

Finally, YOU say a prayer for the faith of your 15 minute listener. Believe me, it will be answered.


#4

Hmm, interesting. The experimental prayer thing seems kinda weird. Don’t we have to have faith when we pray? Plus, i’m thinking specifically of protestants, so they pray already anyway. Thanks for the input yall.


#5

Hi, friend.

If your audience is devout Protestants, then the typology thing is the way to go.

But, you have to know your stuff.

The “prayer experiment” is for lost young folks, mostly.

Does one have to pray with faith, for the “prayer experiment” to work?

If it’s a young person who is lost and searching, God will accept a young person’s doubt-filled faith. God moves first. We respond.


#6

That makes sense, thanks.


#7

Jesus


#8

I think, personally, the best “argument” for Catholicism is that of John Henry Cardinal Newman: “To be deep is history is to cease being a Protestant.” If one objectively looks at the history of the Early Church (starting in Acts), and described by the writings of the Church Fathers (who in many instances were taught by Apostles), as well as the unbroken chain of Apostolic sucession, one can see that Christians, from the earliest days taught the same core dogmas as the Catholic Church today. The Early Church is unquestionably more Catholic than Protestant (of any flavor).


#9

The Eucharist is what did it for me. But in order to really show the Eucharist, you have to have an audience that is willing to examine the early church forefathers and their writings.

Like the post above said, if you get people to study church history, Catholicism is a pretty easy thing to demonstrate as the way its more or less always been.


#10

The Eucharist is what did it for me too. However, I did not look into the history until after I had already been convicted by the Holy Spirit through Bible alone studies!

While in the fundamental branches I would not have listened to anything that was not in the Bible. So trying to show me history, would not have worked. I would not have, nor did I, look at the Early Church Fathers until after I came back!

Great news is that nothing in the Catholic Church contradicts the Bible! You can find the teachings in the Bible. Now studying Scripture and bringing up interpretation of Scripture in context and within history, that is different.

catholic.com/library/Christ_in_the_Eucharist.asp
As Fr. John A. O’Brien explains, "The phrase ‘to eat the flesh and drink the blood,’ when used figuratively among the Jews, as among the Arabs of today, meant to inflict upon a person some serious injury, especially by calumny or by false accusation. To interpret the phrase figuratively then would be to make our Lord promise life everlasting to the culprit for slandering and hating him, which would reduce the whole passage to utter nonsense

But mostly, the best argument depends on the individual. Some would be bowled over by numbers, others by the history, and others through Scripture. The best argument depends on where the person is at in their walk with Christ as well as their personality and the branch of Christianity.

God Bless,
Maria


#11

John 6

A God of mercy and love would not let disciples walk away on a misunderstanding…

If Catholics are right agout THAT…then…


#12

**Hope
**

Proddies and the Muslims believe in predestination

“It is written”
“Masha’allah”

The eastern faiths believe in unending cycles of life and death and or oblivion in Nirvana

Catholicism posits free will and offers salvation to those who choose to act on it

Basically you can “do something”


#13

[quote=BibleReader]Hi.

One of the things I have done is learn Bible typology. If one can show, quickly and efficiently, how Scripture foreshadows a Church with the characteristics of the Catholic Church, in a very short time, one can leave an impression which makes the listener think later about the Church.

Things like this…

“The Nativity story in Luke is not just a story about Jesus’ birth. It’s a picture of the coming of our Savior Whose actual sacrificed body would become our FOOD in Communion, the central sacrament of the Church. The story says that Jesus was born in ‘Bethlehem,’ Hebrew for ‘House of Bread.’ Then the story tells us that when He was born Jesus was wrapped in swaddling clothes and laid in a manger. Notice that, wrapped in swaddling clothes, Jesus looks like a dead body wrapped in a shroud. And a manger is a feeding trough. So, instead of BREAD on a serving plate in ‘the House of Bread,’ we see THE BODY OF SACRIFICED JESUS on a kind of ‘serving plate’ in the ‘the House of Bread.’ The whole Bible is like that! Even the Jewish books of the Old Testament, written before Christ came!”

“For example, Adam, in the story of Adam and Eve, is a ‘picture’ who foreshadows Jesus! So, when God the Father is imposing sentence for the Original Sin in the Garden of Eden, He tells Adam, ‘Thorns and thistles shall it bring forth to you!’ That’s a prophecy of the Crown of Thorns. But then God says, ‘By the sweat of your face shall you get bread to eat!’ That’s a prophecy referring to the bloody sweat of Jesus during His agony in the garden, as He contemplated what was about to happen. Notice that He was earning ‘bread to eat’ – Roman Catholic Eucharist! – by that sweat.”

That kind of prophecy shakes ME up, and makes ME think twice!

.
[/quote]

Way cool exegesis! I don’t think in pictures, so I would never have visuallized all this. Is there a book (or, more in the spirit, a video), that has more of this Bible typology stuff?


#14

[quote=grandadmiralboo]Is there a best argument for Catholicism? If so what is it? I just wish i could “prove” Catholicism in one nice 15 minutes or less argument. I mean, I know Catholicism is true, but that’s based on everything I’ve learned about the Church in the past, which is quite a bit, i couldn’t even begin to summarize it into a nice clean argument, cuz every point depends on everything else. I wouldn’t know where to start!! I’m just curious what other people thought about this.
[/quote]

This is a good start:
catholic.com/library/Pillar.asp


#15

Ephesians 4:5**
**5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;


Matthew 16:18-19**
**18 And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.

19 I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."


#16

JMJ


GOD ON HIS TERMS?


Every large organization has to have its own rule set to function and to distinguish themselves from other similar organizations. Who they are and what they practice.

Other Protestant, non-Catholic religions, (I’ve heard there are about 36.000 different versions of Christianity) have their own rule sets. Different rule sets/beliefs equal different faiths/religions. If you have ever wondered why there are so many versions of Christianity, it’s because people over the years wanted God on their terms and not on God’s terms. Example; there are some “Christian Religions” who condone “homosexual marriage”, Christianity on their terms.

The New Testament / **Mt. **16:18 “You are Peter, a stone; and upon this rock I will build my church; and all the powers of hell shall not prevail against it”. (Beginning of God’s church on earth). / Mt. 16:19 “and I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven; whatever door you lock on earth shall be locked in heaven; and whatever doors you open on earth shall be open in heaven” (The authority of the church through the succession of Popes) / Eph 4:5 “For us there is only one Lord, one faith, one baptism” (verses taken from the Catholic Living Bible).

Now if you read these verses, it doesn’t allow for 36,000 different belief systems or versions of Christianity. One church was given the authority from God and it was the Catholic Church. I believe all that is true and good from other religions are true and good; However the Catholic church represent total truth and goodness and the others represent partial truths. Modifications from the original, to meet their rule sets, God on their terms. There can only be one Church. As a Catholic, you must continue to grow and learn about your faith. We are living in an information age. If you put some effort into to learning about your faith, you will discover the richness of the Catholic Church. You will also discover that the Catholic Church’s teachings are in line with Christ’s teachings. Continue your journey!

Yours in Christ,

Jimmy B


#17

A key thing for me was the thousands of differnent denominations and the dozens of conflicting interpretations using the Bible alone. THe disunity and the sheer insanity of indiviudalism that is the result of private interpretation is something prots can’t easily get around. Truth is singular there can’t be dozens of different and conflicting interpretations that are true. Who is the arbriter of truth in protestantism. Ultimately that is left to the individual.

That is not the church desribed in the NT which was very authoratarian they had council announced something without fighting about scripture and it was thus saith the lord case closed only catholcism has such a mechansim as a church council described in Acts 15. Protestantsim have church splits because ultiamtely no one person has more authority than another. The papacy is really a gift from God that gives the church unity.
Protestantism wished they had unity they don’t. Even churches within the same denomination ultimately disagree on important issues.
I really got tired of playing Bible tennis to trump another fellow christian to prove I had the proper interpretation of scripture.
I much rather be a child that learns from the shephred the Pope who guides the church into truth via the holy spirit. THe holy spirit cannot be guiding thousands of different churches into conflicting interpretation. WHo speaks for God today? Only the catholic church can make a strong claim for that.


#18

I really got tired of playing Bible tennis to trump another fellow christian to prove I had the proper interpretation of scripture.
I much rather be a child that learns from the shephred the Pope who guides the church into truth via the holy spirit. THe holy spirit cannot be guiding thousands of different churches into conflicting interpretation. WHo speaks for God today? Only the catholic church can make a strong claim for that.

:amen:


#19

One of the best arguments for someone who already accepts belief in Christ is simply history. LOOK AT HISTORY! The protestant and other religions were created hundreds of years after Christ. The Catholic Church alone existed and was founded upon St. Peter from the very beginning. Look at the writings of the early Church Fathers. They support the Catholic beliefs and not the protestants or other non-Catholics.


#20

[quote=Steve Andersen]Hope

Proddies and the Muslims believe in predestination

“It is written”
“Masha’allah”

The eastern faiths believe in unending cycles of life and death and or oblivion in Nirvana

Catholicism posits free will and offers salvation to those who choose to act on it

Basically you can “do something”
[/quote]

Steve…Most Protestants do NOT believe in predestination…I was brought up in the Methodist Church, and have had many experiences with other Protestant churches…Also…It is disrespectful to call Protestants “proddies”…I really do take offense at this, and I am not even a Protestant…

Catholic Heart


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