What's the difference between Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses?

I always get the two mixed up and I know I could search it on google but I’d prefer to hear it from a Catholic perspective. So what’s the difference between mormons and jehovahs witnesses (other than jehovah’s witnesses love to come and witness to me at home on Saturday at 9am)?

Mormons celebrate Christmas, JWs don’t. That’s the most important difference. :slight_smile:

Haaaa, it’s all clear to me now!

JWs believe that birthdays are evil or pagan (something to do with a beheading or something in the bible that took place “on a birthday”). They have also changed their teachings more (I think there’s evidence they once acknowledged Christmas…now they don’t). They also don’t believe in the Flag, patriotic songs, (military service - I THINK) and other holidays like Thanksgiving. The woman who babysat me when I was 6 is a JW…my mom saw her at a free summer concert at a park…and she did NOT stand for the Pledge of Allegiance or National Anthem. They are also anti catholic.

Mormons think the church was restored by Joseph Smith who got gold plates from an angel named moroni. But yet…these gold plates disappeared

The commonality is they are both restorationist religions, arising in 19th century United States during the second great awakening.

Mormonism, Adventism and the Bible Student movement arose during this time. Mormonism is based on the claims of Joseph Smith, who claimed to be a prophet, charged with restoring Christ’s Church.

Adventism is based on the claims of William Miller, a baptist who formed a new Christian denomination based on key Biblical verses that he viewed, and taught, as Biblical chronological evidence for the imminent coming of Christ. (Something LDS hold in common as well.)

Charles Taze Russell was influenced by Adventism, but broke off on his own, forming his own ideas of Bible chronology and associated meanings. Shortly after his break from Adventism he formed the “Zion’s Watch Tower Tract Society” Russell was a prolific writer and self-published numerous tracts, books and pamphlets.

Both LDS and JW’s believe that God wants them to spread their teachings by going door to door, and so both have the familiar (to most) missionaries that knock on your door, or approach people on the street.

Theologically, they are both non-Trinitarian, have a different Christology when compared to each other, but neither Christology align to Christian teaching.

JW’s believe in the bible, and follow the teachings of Jesus the closest of any religion. They seem to be very misunderstood, and if you actually listen to their message it flows together seamlessly. I have studied with them and was charged with proving the scriptures they gave me wrong. Honestly I couldn’t, and it was ok for me to have to adjust my way of thinking about the scriptures after careful study. Look…

They believe that due to Adam/Eve’s sin

Genesis 3:15 -And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

This refers to Jesus dying for our sins to reverse the sin we inherited. Jesus is bruised in the heel by Satan, then he bruises him in the head at the conclusion of things. They also believe that through Jesus (Jesus means YHWH is salvation) humans are able to be saved.

John 3:16- For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

They also don’t believe God and Jesus are the same person, and this was difficult for me…But after analyzing how the previous Israelites and Christians lived during Jesus era, they recognized God as YHWH. Look…

 Exodus 3:15-And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.

Look at how it is translated from the Septuagint (70 who translated Hebrew scrolls to Greek during Jesus Day, and these are the same manuscripts used by Jesus and his disciples)

 Exodus 3:15-God said moreover to Moses, "You shall tell the children of Israel this, 'Yahweh, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations.

Interestingly enough Barnes’ Notes “ The name signifies that by which God makes Himself known, the memorial that by which His people worship Him.” Notice this applies to all generations…Also take a look at this scripture found at

Psalms 83:18-That men may know that thou, whose name alone is Jehovah, art the most high over all the earth.

This scripture haunted my belief that I held on to dearly about God Jesus being equal. This is from Jesus’ lips…

John 13:16-Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.

From reading John 3:16 we clearly see that Jesus was sent by YHWH, and he is in constant submission to YHWH, who resurrected him on the third day.
I have to say I tried to defend my belief with everything I had, but it just makes too much sense to me. I will honestly say I learned more in studying for 3 months than I have learned in my entire life. I have never been encouraged to read the bible myself, and try to find error. I couldn’t, the difference I found is that JW’s know the bible, and their beliefs are strictly based off the scriptures….Please if anyone can find error in what I have presented please show me that I may make a solid defense.

Pharaoh killed his baker on his birthday (Story of Joseph in Genesis 40, birthday referenced in verse 20) , and John the Baptist was beheaded on Herod’s birthday (Matthew 14:6-10)

As far as I know, that’s the verses they use in justifying not celebrating birthdays.

To Christian AD
Ill have to come back to you when I have more time. I promise I will.
To the OP.

The LDS (mormons) believe that jesus and St Michael the Archangle are the same.
They believe in a former of poly theism based on the belief that we will become goods to other worlds and our god was a man on a world not unlike ours and lived a human like life.

They believe the book of Mormon was given to their prophet and he translated it from the languages of a lost native American civilisation. It tells of Jesus coming to them.

They believe that Western Christianity failed. God gave up on it and started Again with the LDS.

The JWs are a Sola Scriptura sect with a very damaged understanding of biblical exgesis. They take Bible quotes out of context. They reject or deliberately misstranslate certain biblical texts which don’t tally with their beliefs. They use their own translation for this purpose the NWT. No biblical or language scholars were on the “translation” team.

They deny the divinity of Christ and the Holy Spirit.

As both are non trinitarian both sets are non Christian as underestimate by
Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Protestantism, Episcopalianism, and evangelical Christians who don’t consider themselves Protestant.

Mormons ride their bikes and JW’s walk…:stuck_out_tongue:

ChristianAD,

I am still looking for the name of the JW before Charles Taze Russell and subsequently before that person and so on back to Christ. I see this as being important as with your arguments beg many questions that have been erased by our early church fathers.

I asked a JW not long ago who were some early Christians (I understand they wouldn’t be called JW) that preached JW beliefs. After stumbling and not being able to “remember” the names I decided to throw out some. She stopped me at Justin Martyr and said “yea, I remember that name, he was one”!:eek: Obviously this can’t be true if you know anything about Justin Martyr but I hope you see the point. I left it with this question open and either they will come up with a list of early Christians w/ JW beliefs that I just don’t know about yet or not.

Can you answer this question? Do you not see the importance of this?

Peace!!!

I’ve seen Mormons on the bus around here, and I think JW’s drive. For awhile they (the JW’s) had me targeted because I happened to take the time to “listen” to them a few times. They finally took the hint that I wasn’t interested in their version of events and left me alone. :smiley:

No, that’s the Jehovah’s Witnesses. LDS believe that Michael the Archangel is Adam in his pre-mortal existence.

My understanding is that **Mormon’s do not believe **in a transcendant, self existing, sprititual being who was God from all eternity. Their theology is that gods were human men first and then attained deity. For example, the being in our Scriptures referred to as God the Father was at one time a human man. Like many atheists, they believe in eternal matter. From that man evolved; from man eventually deity evolved or was attained. And so god/s as gods had a beginning. (Please correct me if this is erroneous.)

I think **JW’s do believe **in the existence of an eternal God. (But they don’t believe in a Triune Godhead; they don’t believe Jesus is God.)

To me that question is irrelevant…at one point in time Adolf Hitler was considered a catholic and even asked for permission from Pope Pius XII to enter war. Another example is the Israelites due to their lack of obedience they lost favor in God’s eyes, and as a result they lost his spirit. So to me the past doesn’t automatically make you righteous in the future. Especially, when there has been continued abuse to the sanctifying of God’s name. We have developed the term sola inscripta, which means only scripture. Do you believe that the scriptures were inspired by God’s Spirit? Jesus stated man doesn’t survive on bread alone but every utterance of GOD. So if Jesus quoted and lived his life according to everything that was written in the Hebrew scrolls and he is our example to follow on earth I personally don’t believe sola inscripta is wrong….
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, reproving and setting matters straight.
I don’t want to speak from my own understanding Jesus stated we have to be as children to receive the word of GOD. One thing the JWs helped me to understand was in order for me to truly understand GOD I have to study the word, and check everything against the scritpures…GOD is perfect, men are not, but his word is perfect……
I use any bible, plus I use scrolls that you can peer into to make sure you understand accurately. I would love to share some of the treasures I have found. Look….

eliyah.com/lxx.html
eliyah.com/saidname.html

I was not implying that a righteous past insures a righteous future. I just think it should be easy to show a righteous line of believers up to or prior to Russell. It was not so long ago. Can you name some JWs prior to Russell?

We have developed the term sola inscripta, which means only scripture.

I know what it means but it is an extremely flawed concept. based on John 21:25, John 20:30, more if you like…

Paul preached/developed Sacred Tradition and It means “not only” scripture, see 2Thes 2:15 & 1Cor 11:2, more if you like…

Remember, all these nuggets of scripture were written many years prior to the completion and compilation of the NT.

Do you believe that the scriptures were inspired by God’s Spirit?

I certainly do. I just watched a JW video depicting this very thing. The problem is, after the video showed humans making the papyrus, humans writing the Word (inspired by God of course), humans stitching the individual codices, it failed to show the humans gathering and compiling these individual codices to make a full bible. It just skipped over that part and showed a full bible. How did it get compiled? Who decided which of the hundreds of writings would be included? I would think this was a very important part of God’s process in insuring His Word is able to be distributed in an organized manner to the world. More so than the making of the papyrus itself.

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, reproving and setting matters straight.

All scripture certainly is good. Its the “only” part of you should question.

I don’t want to speak from my own understanding Jesus stated we have to be as children to receive the word of GOD. One thing the JWs helped me to understand was in order for me to truly understand GOD I have to study the word, and check everything against the scritpures…GOD is perfect, men are not, but his word is perfect……
I use any bible, plus I use scrolls that you can peer into to make sure you understand accurately. I would love to share some of the treasures I have found. Look….

eliyah.com/lxx.html
eliyah.com/saidname.html

I sure wish I knew Hebrew and/or Greek, heck I wish I knew a JW that could read it and I know quite a few. ;). Do you think Jesus intended to make a system where it is mandatory for every single person to read and understand Hebrew and/or Greek?

Peace be with you always!!!

You can start trying to understand the scrolls (Hebrew/Greek) look at the links I inlcluded previously if you are really serious about the truth of God. I started looking for his name first…

aleppocodex.org/newsite/index.html
dss.collections.imj.org.il/ (Isaiah Scrolls)

Moses commanded the Israelites to read the scrolls day and night. Also to teach their children and hang the commandments over their doorpost as a reminder. This illustrates the importance of knowing God. Also you speak of tradition in these scritptures, which they were speaking about a portion of the tradition they received from Christ (his death), but also a few principles of the law of Moses…Remember even Jesus recognized the Sabbath….

2 Thess 2:15 So, then, brothers, stand firm+ and maintain YOUR hold on the 
traditions+ that YOU were taught, whether it was through a verbal message or through 
a letter of ours

1 Cor 11:2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the 
ordinances, as I delivered them to you

What really makes no sense is that the Catholic Church compiled the bible, and yet we are told not to rely on the Word of God as sola inscriptura. Also, if God designated a specific name to be called, and the Sabbath to be on a specific day, how can a man decide to change that? This is why it takes humility to receive God’s word and we have to be as children. We block out what negates our traditional belief rather than accepting the scriptures. What does an Easter Bunny have to do with Jesus’ Death? Think about what happened when the Israelites included a golden calf with their worship to God….Exodus 32 1-35, many people died. What makes us different from the judgment the chosen people of God received. We have their example and we are under a more exclusive covenant through Jesus, how much more so should we take this serious.
Jesus also stated this

Matt 15:3 “Why is it YOU also overstep the commandment of God because of YOUR 
tradition”…

Also at
Luke 4:16 Jesus attended the Sabbath on the day it was originally on, and he didn’t
change that day himself, and he is our King….

To adf417- Can you name some JWs prior to Russell?

At times God has used prophets from herds of sheep to align his people with truth. In his scriptures has always chose a lowly one and rose them to complete power with them submissive to God’s direction. So did it matter what is line was as long as he declared God’s word in truth. It seems that you are only trying to validate your tradition rather than the word of God….If a person comes to you with truth in scriptures are they his words or are they God’s?

Luke 1:52 He has brought down men of power+ from thrones and exalted lowly 
ones;+ 53 he has fully satisfied hungry ones with good things+ and he has sent away 
empty those who had wealth.

Tradition is not the foundation, this is why we have the bible to keep us in line with God (Do you believe this is why God inspired men to write?), this is why in the Hebrew scriptures God instructed not only the king but is chosen people to read in an undertone day and night…

Psalms 1:1 Happy+ is the man* that has not walked in the counsel of the wicked ones,
And in the way of sinners has not stood, And in the seat of ridiculers has not sat. 2 But
his delight is in the law of YHWH, And in his law he reads in an undertone day and
night.

If Jesus said that we must live on every utterance of God, do you think you are overstepping his commandment by saying we need to follow tradition that has been created after Jesus and his disciples death. Research your history…Believe me I felt just as you did, but I was hungry for truth….

My brothers I leave you with this scripture and love…

John 17:3 This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you the only true      
God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ… 

How do we get this knowledge?:shrug:

They didn’t “include” a golden calf in their worship to God, they worshiped the golden calf as God.

ChristianAD, you might want to start a new thread on tradition vs. sola scriptura and/or the history of the canon of scripture as I think we have officially high jacked this thread. Be assured I, as well as everyone here, am serious about the truth of God and want to make sure we don’t miss anything. If anything you have written is true, surly you won’t mind sharing this “truth” in light of forum rules. Please let me know the name of the new thread so I can join and continue this discussion.

To the OP…The differences, or should I say similarities, of JWs and Mormons is they both have a starting point much later than Pentecost when the apostles received the Holy Spirit and passed it own. Can either of these religions provide a Christian believer, no matter how lowly, professing their beliefs prior to their original founders (Russell/Smith)? If not, how are we to believe they have the truth?

Peace!!!

JW’s believe in the bible, and follow the teachings of Jesus the closest of any religion. They seem to be very misunderstood, and if you actually listen to their message it flows together seamlessly. I have studied with them and was charged with proving the scriptures they gave me wrong. Honestly I couldn’t, and it was ok for me to have to adjust my way of thinking about the scriptures after careful study. Look…

Seamless? I don’t know the level of your affiliation with the JW, but from your speech and use of key JW scriptures, it seems you are already a member. I will ask you about 3 very strange doctrines that are not seamless in view of the Bible, and ask that you just have to answer one.

  1. When in Christian History before Rutherford and maybe even CT Russel was the teaching that Christians would be divided into two groups? That somehow the majority of Christians are not part of the Body of Christ, do not have Jesus as their mediator, but benefit from the mediation between the little flock and Jesus? That despite John 6, eating and drinking the body and blood of Christ is not necessary for life, ever, not even the one time a year the option is even available? Passing the bread and wine around, while all refuse to eat, to only throw it away after the little party is over; seamless Christian tradition alright.

  2. When did Jews or Christians ever believe that we are not judged on our lives right now? You do realize that JW teach that almost everyone will be resurrected, good and bad, and only then will their lives be what they are judged on.

  3. And finally, 1914 invisible return of Christ to rule as king??? When in Christian History, did anyone teach that Christ wasn’t already King, from conception, and definitely at his resurrection. I would love for you to explain the 1914 math, showing the prophecies that explained it. You know the 7 times, and using wrong dates like 607.

I hope you realize that there are great thinkers in the Church and always have been, just because the Church doesn’t force its people to learn it all, does not make them bad. You have to take responsibility for yourself if you need the extra knowledge.

They are both a few sandwiches shy of a picnic IMO. They are not christians.

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