When did children become an inconveniece?


#1

Ok first let me say that I'm single. I chose not to have children without being married and now it's more than likely I will never have any but still I have to say I find all these threads about NFP troubling. It's like everyone is out to do what they can to avoid children. I'm not for having 15 or 20 like the Duggars but whatever happened to the families of 5 or six kids. It's like three became the norm and now only one or two is?? Just looking for thoughts on this. Do you think we've all lost focus on more important things?


#2

I'm 30 years old, single, and I don't have any kids either. I think your partially right, partially wrong. Some people view children as an inconvenience, but still others view them as a necessity for happiness, and let them run wild. I have a niece and nephew I adore, when I go to dances, t-ball games, etc~so many kids are running roughshod. When I talk to parents, they seem to live vicariously though their child....the kid is the center of their world, hardly an inconvenience.

I'm in the middle on myself wanting kids. I need to be married first, (of course) but if I never have them, I don't think it'll matter to me. I'm still young, so I could change my mind. When I tell people that I don't think I want them-they look at me like I'm insane.


#3

Our society is changing, as societies do. People who want many children and have them are very blessed and lucky. But not everyone is called to have many children and to be pregnant year after year after year. It's hard to manage a home with many children, and it's expensive too. One has to be able to provide for all of them spiritually and emotionally, not just financially. It's not just a matter of having kids to increase the Catholic population, you have to actually spend time with and CARE for these little people.

Children can bring warmth and life to a home. A home with many children can be lively and loving and wonderful. But not everyone is capable of managing a household with many children. While one person views the boisterous activity of a home with many children as music, another would be velcroed to the ceiling with the two that they have. Not everyone is the same, and it is wise to know when too much is too much.


#4

[quote="Rence, post:3, topic:203137"]
another would be velcroed to the ceiling .

[/quote]

No, no, no. Velcro doesn't work as well as duct tape does!


#5

[quote="Sierrah, post:1, topic:203137"]
Ok first let me say that I'm single. I chose not to have children without being married and now it's more than likely I will never have any but still I have to say I find all these threads about NFP troubling. It's like everyone is out to do what they can to avoid children. I'm not for having 15 or 20 like the Duggars but whatever happened to the families of 5 or six kids. It's like three became the norm and now only one or two is?? Just looking for thoughts on this. Do you think we've all lost focus on more important things?

[/quote]

I don't think it's fair to assume that those who use NFP are doing so for reasons of "convenience"...
In fact, I think that goes AGAINST the very PURPOSE of NFP.

NFP is a moral family planning tool... and there are *many *moral and prayerful reasons why couples would need to use NFP. Those who use NFP with the correct purpose are usually struggling in one way or another. These are families that need support, prayers, and hope that their situation can change.

Please open your heart to understanding that not everyone is being selfish. Don't judge by outward appearances. ;)


#6

[quote="Rence, post:3, topic:203137"]
Our society is changing, as societies do. People who want many children and have them are very blessed and lucky. But not everyone is called to have many children and to be pregnant year after year after year. It's hard to manage a home with many children, and it's expensive too. One has to be able to provide for all of them spiritually and emotionally, not just financially. It's not just a matter of having kids to increase the Catholic population, you have to actually spend time with and CARE for these little people.

Children can bring warmth and life to a home. A home with many children can be lively and loving and wonderful. But not everyone is capable of managing a household with many children. While one person views the boisterous activity of a home with many children as music, another would be velcroed to the ceiling with the two that they have. Not everyone is the same, and it is wise to know when too much is too much.

[/quote]

What's this? The voice of reason on CAF? I must be dreaming.


#7

Children ARE an inconvenience. But then I do a lot of inconvenient things...

I think that some folks look at having kids as another hobby. Kids is something that they do, that they find value in (particularly in all the activities of the overscheduled children out there that are supposedly "for the kids"). But like all hobbies, it has to fit in with the others, and when this one is played out (ie. 2 kids worth of diapers/mommy and me classes/babies in the shopping cart at the grocery store), it's time for some new hobbies...

You can't necessarily judge who those people are, family size certainly doesn't determine it, and even a statement of "being done" doesn't either. There are lots of people out there who are thrilled to have the chance at being "inconvenienced" repeatedly, and many who ache to be so "inconvenienced" but can't. It's not easy to recognize who is who at first, second, or third glance. But I have definitely gotten the impression over the years that for many parents, "doing the kid thing" is just one of the many activities that a well rounded adult ought to do a couple of times.


#8

I think kids became an inconveince when they started crying all the time, taking up all our free-time, always getting in trouble, hanging out with the wrong friends, using all of our money, and sticking around for at least 18 years. :)

Oh yeah, and when we didn't need them anymore as extra farm-hands. :)


#9

[quote="Em_in_FL, post:5, topic:203137"]
I don't think it's fair to assume that those who use NFP are doing so for reasons of "convenience"...
In fact, I think that goes AGAINST the very PURPOSE of NFP.

NFP is a moral family planning tool... and there are *many *moral and prayerful reasons why couples would need to use NFP. Those who use NFP with the correct purpose are usually struggling in one way or another. These are families that need support, prayers, and hope that their situation can change.

Please open your heart to understanding that not everyone is being selfish. Don't judge by outward appearances. ;)

[/quote]

This.

I think you have the group of people that do consider kids an inconvience and use ABC with the ones that are trying to be responsible parents and follow Church teachings.

And yes, do not judge someone just by the number of kids they have and how they feel about having children. There may be any number of reasons why God designs a small family, none that may have anything to do with NFP or ABC.


#10

Living in a big city, college age, professionals everywhere ... there are some circumstances where I find myself strangely getting annoyed at small kids. Thankfully though, I'm able to stop myself, have a good laugh and let those little ones brighten my day.

It's a very sad thought when we as a society only look upon non-adults as inconveniences, and merely troubling to our daily lives and routines. It's pretty scary.


#11

Since the rich realised it was not in their interests to encourage the peasants to increase their numbers and started telling them they would be happier if they just bought their latest products and didn't have any kids so they would be free to act like kids themselves and pursue a life of decadence and indulgence rather than a life of service and obedience to God.

Which I put at around the year 1900 give or take 50 years.


#12

[quote="cojorgensen, post:10, topic:203137"]
Living in a big city, college age, professionals everywhere ... there are some circumstances where I find myself strangely getting annoyed at small kids. Thankfully though, I'm able to stop myself, have a good laugh and let those little ones brighten my day.

It's a very sad thought when we as a society only look upon non-adults as inconveniences, and merely troubling to our daily lives and routines. It's pretty scary.

[/quote]

Your not completely to blame for that, a lot of them are annoying due to inadequate parenting as a result of the influence of liberal thought upon the family and the minds of parents.


#13

[quote="rick43235, post:6, topic:203137"]
What's this? The voice of reason on CAF? I must be dreaming.

[/quote]

It's great isn't it!:thumbsup:


#14

[quote="Rence, post:3, topic:203137"]
Our society is changing, as societies do. People who want many children and have them are very blessed and lucky. But not everyone is called to have many children and to be pregnant year after year after year. It's hard to manage a home with many children, and it's expensive too. One has to be able to provide for all of them spiritually and emotionally, not just financially. It's not just a matter of having kids to increase the Catholic population, you have to actually spend time with and CARE for these little people.

Children can bring warmth and life to a home. A home with many children can be lively and loving and wonderful. But not everyone is capable of managing a household with many children. While one person views the boisterous activity of a home with many children as music, another would be velcroed to the ceiling with the two that they have. Not everyone is the same, and it is wise to know when too much is too much.

[/quote]

What a great explanation...
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


#15

[quote="Em_in_FL, post:5, topic:203137"]
I don't think it's fair to assume that those who use NFP are doing so for reasons of "convenience"...
In fact, I think that goes AGAINST the very PURPOSE of NFP.

NFP is a moral family planning tool... and there are *many *moral and prayerful reasons why couples would need to use NFP. Those who use NFP with the correct purpose are usually struggling in one way or another. These are families that need support, prayers, and hope that their situation can change.

Please open your heart to understanding that not everyone is being selfish. Don't judge by outward appearances. ;)

[/quote]

Amen to this! :thumbsup:

I don't have a "problem" with anyone having any number of kids--one kid or 20--as long as they are following God's will for their family. It's easy for us to think we know what a "good" sized Catholic family is, or for us to think that we can judge someone else's circumstances...but we really can't. We should pray that all married couples open themselves to God's will and prayerfully discern His will for their lives.


#16

I think its not just that society hates kids or something so easy as that, but the financial situation has changed. Back in the day people could survive on one income and churn out a large number of kids. My friend's dad comes from a family of 10 and they survived on one income, and their father was a carpenter, so it wasn't like he was raking in huge amounts of money like a doctor or lawyer or something.

But now, people have built up a society based on material need. People need to keep up with the Joneses as the saying goes, and that means fancy TVs, new cars every few years a big house, fancy clothes. And often, they are trying to live like a King on a Pauper's salary. So, people have to decide do they want 5 kids or a plasma screen TV. And you look at what kids these days have, so much junk, I grew up in the 80s with hand me down clothes, simple toys, I had one Barbie that lasted me my child hood, (even when I went through my Inquisition burning at the stake stage!) and we had a small black and white TV for most of it. And we turned out just fine. My parents would have had more kids if not for my mum being rendered infertile by illness.

I'm single, 29, and childless (having never been married, you see) and it seems to me from what I see of my friends' and family's kids that they're not interested in getting outside climbing tress and God forbid if you do have a black and white small TV. They want the best, playstations, computers, toys that are really just junk. I mean, the new Transformers toys? What a pile of rubbish! The dicast were so much sturdier!

I think its sad really. There were three kids in my family, and some people considered that too many!

I really hope its God's will to get me to the altar soon cos I wanna pop out a stink load of kids! (I hoping on mutliples to get me there faster!!)


#17

Not everyone has the means to take care of a big family.

If everyone had 6 children, the world would get very populated very quicky... and we already have problems with a bad economy and unemployment. Not that it's bad to have a big family, it's just not for everyone.

Also, growing up isn't as safe as it used to be. Kids used to play in the street all the time. Soccer, hockey, baseball... now there are maniacs that speed down streets and don't care about anyone but themselves. My neighbor's daughter almost got hit twice on her way to her school, which is just 1/4 mile from her house! People might choose to have fewer children so they can keep a closer eye on them and make sure they're okay.

Other times, someone might get a child that constantly gets into everything, or doesn't get along well with smaller children. Because of this, the couple doesn't choose to have another baby until that child is 4 or 5 years old (in preschool or kindergarten). Spacing children farther apart leads to fewer children.

People are getting married later in life. Many studies show that [most] people shouldn't get married before age 25, and that the human brain isn't fully developed until age 25-30. Getting married later in life leads to fewer children, since a couple doesn't start having children until over a decade into the woman's child-bearing years.

Some people just don't like or want any children. They are too busy with work and other activities, or simply don't have the patience required to be a parent.


#18

Once people were given the choice not to have children and still have sex.


#19

ANYBODY or ANYTHING that is important is going to be a source of inconvenience at least some of the time. A child is no exception. And I don't think that this is anything new in the history of the human race.

I think what's changed is the expectations the parents of today have for their children and for themselves as providers. People tend to be more interested in having their children obtain earthly "success" than they are of increasing the population of heaven. (And there is nothing objectively wrong with earthly success. I think it's a God-given desire to provide the best for our children.) But I think it's also a value today to baby our children for a longer time period than was common in previous generations.

As others have said, those who use NFP to space their children or reduce the overall number of children may have very good reasons to do so.


#20

[quote="Sierrah, post:1, topic:203137"]
Ok first let me say that I'm single. I chose not to have children without being married and now it's more than likely I will never have any but still I have to say I find all these threads about NFP troubling. It's like everyone is out to do what they can to avoid children. I'm not for having 15 or 20 like the Duggars but whatever happened to the families of 5 or six kids. It's like three became the norm and now only one or two is?? Just looking for thoughts on this. Do you think we've all lost focus on more important things?

[/quote]

Well, let me play the devils advocate here. If having children is what we should focus on, then my question to you is 'Why aren't you married with kids'.

I am sure that statement offended you. It is to make a point. Do not judge since you probably don't like to be judged yourself. The most important thing is to do God's will. Do I believe people plan their families according to God's will. NO. I think probably most people (inside the church almost as often as outside the church) use ABC. But I do not judge. (mainly for fear of judging the couple who desperately want more kids and are suffereing because they can't).

God is a just God. He knows that in our society it is harder to have kids than before. He will judge people accordingly

CM


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