Where to find a legit Novus Ordo?

A book I read recently (The Liturgy Betrayed, by Crouan) spoke about the post-Vatican II debate between TLM’ers and modern Novus Ordo’ers as irrelevant: that the real travesty is that a Mass was created that a year or two afterwards was tossed out for being too traditional: I’m speaking of the Novus Ordo as it was written, with incense, ad orientum, chant, Latin, the whole shebang.

Anybody know where to find one?? The book called for our right to attend the true Mass of Vatican II, but sympathized with TLM’ers because the true Novus Ordo is nowhere to be found.

PS: I don’t mean, legit, or real as my own personal opinions or preferences, but rather what came straight from the council.

We had one just as you describe (incense, ad orientum, chant, Latin, the whole shebang) during Holy Week, and Father does the Eucharistic prayer in Latin on Thursdays. Every other time he can he drags out the thurible and the Sanctus, etc. :slight_smile: But I agree with you that these types of OF Masses are few and far between.

Our pastor likes to say that he is trying to implement the “true” spirit of Vatican 2.

Nothing got “thrown out.” Everything you list are “legit” options.

There’s a lot of other threads for a VII debate, I really would like to know where to find a Novus Ordo celebrated as originally written.

I cannot tell you about your diocese. However, in my diocese of Arlington there is a Latin Novus Ordo with chant, incense. It is the high mass at 10:30 at St. Catherine of Siena in Great Falls, VA. There might be others in the Diocese of Arlington and Washington but that is the one I went to frequently. The Latin Novus Ordo is quite beautiful. It is a lot longer than the secular language Novus Ordo so the church is fairly empty because families do not like the longer mass time. It is about an hour and a half long.

My Parish has the original Novus Ordo each Sunday - but only Sunday, unlike the EF, which is available all week long.


There is no “high” or “low” Mass in the OF.

How about for starters you tell us where you live - what town, what country. Then we just might be able to point you to Latin OF Masses in your area.

It’s kind of difficult to help you when you give us zero useful information to work with. :shrug:

All the things you mentioned, except for incence (some NO Masses actually do not have it) were thrown out at Vatican II, so it’s a bit hard to tell you where you may find a “legit” Novus Ordo. If you have a TLM nearby, I highly recommend going to it. If you don’t, though, then you could always try to find a NO that has all that stuff, but it will be quite difficult. I don’t have an NO anywhere near me that is that reverent. A TLM would really be your best option if possible.

The book called for our right to attend the true Mass of Vatican II

I am not sure if the OF Mass is the Mass that the Council Fathers had in mind when they wrote Sacrosanctum Concilium. I think the OF Mass is the product of one man: Annibale Bugnini. The OF Mass was his creation and he was the chief author; I think this Mass was heavily influenced by his personal interpretation of Sacrosanctum Concilium, and less by what the Vatican II actually mandated.

This is my personal opinion, but I really believe Vatican II intended to make slight changes to the existing Mass of John XXIII. I do not believe Vatican II called for the creation of a completely new Mass; I believe it called for a revision of the existing Roman rite. The Mass of Paul VI ruptured the organic development of the Roman rite; one Mass was replaced with another, and there was no continuity; ancient prayers were scrapped and replaced by entirely new ones without historical foundation. In my opinion, this was an act of liturgical suicide, which sent the Roman rite into a spiral of confusion and disorientation. The problem with the liturgical reform was that nothing was untouchable; they changed things just for the sake of changing things. Some of the changes were not needed; in fact, in my opinion, some of the changes have been damaging.

It is a shame that we never got to see the real Mass of Vatican II. I think it would have been a version of the Tridentine Mass with more vernacular, and more options so that it could be adapted to other cultures, for instance, the option of making the Mass more palatable to African societies.

I hope that one day, soon, we’ll get to see the real Novus Ordo Mass in all parishes…

San Antonio, TX. Our Lady of the Atonement Catholic Church offers the OF (Novus Ordo) in Latin on all Sundays of the year, excluding Easter Sunday (first Sunday of the Resurrection—Novus Ordo offered all other Sundays of joyous Eastertide, Ordinary Time, Advent and Lent, Christmas season–the Sundays included thereof—and Palm Sunday) at 6:00 pm. It has incense, men’s schola singing propers, chanted parts belonging to the celebrant and the people, deacon chanting the Holy Gospel and the Prayers of the Faithful, and Holy Communion by intinction exclusively (I know canon law normally permits the people to select which method they will receive, but our variance to use the AU also extends to the method of reception of Our Lord Jesus Christ in the Novus Ordo such that the laity and deacons receive by intinction exclusively). It also is offered during the school year at 9:00 am on Fridays (with some modifications in the ceremony used, i.e, no incense).

Easter Sunday & Vigil and other holy day Masses, including Christmas Eve and Morning, celebrated exclusively according to the Anglican Use.


15415 Red Robin
San Antonio, TX 78255

Web: www.atonementonline.com

(Located off the Anderson Loop West)

I hope this helps.

Paul R. Viola

The majority of the Masses in Arlington are beautiful and reverant. They may be in English (or Spanish, or another language) not Latin, but I haven’t found too many examples of the “spirit” of Vatican II here.

Had a rethink. Your best courses of action would be either to contact the office of your local diocese, and ask if any of the parishes in the diocese offer a Latin OF Mass (the diocesan office would be aware of them), or to contact the parishes individually and ask if they do so.

Also thanks Paul!

I specifically didn’t mention where I am, because my diocese is not one to do such things. But I do travel a lot, and also just curious… TLM’s are catalogued on a bunch of sites, but I don’t think the original Novus Ordo’s are… not many people know about them I guess.

How nice it would be to see one of these! At the Masses I usually attend… well it just wears me down after a while. A couple times a year I go out of the way to attend a TLM, to have some peace of mind at Mass.


Is there an Anglican Use parish near you? I know it’s not the same, and it’s in the vernacular, but the music is truly breathtaking and you have all the “high church” trappings, including altar rail and intinction. Sadly, there are only 6 in the States, I believe…there is a website that lists them.

As in one in union with Rome? No, I really don’t think so. Good suggestion though, never thought about that!

The nearest TLM is an hour + drive away :frowning: Everything else is your standard English, piano and guitar music kind of Mass. I would love to check out some other rites of the Church, like Byzantine and Ukrainian, but unfortunately there’s none anywhere close either!

Yes, Anglican Use Latin Rite parishes, under the Pastoral Provision. We’re blessed to have 4 of the 7 here in Texas. Gorgeous liturgy! I suppose the homilies may vary, but the parish I’ve attended many times seems to have orthodox pastors.

Here’s a listing:


Just stick with the TLM.

Now you’ve got me ready to go to one :slight_smile: They’re all so far away though… hopefully they’ll increase in the future!

That’s the plan for now :slight_smile: Would you believe I’ve only been to two though? :eek::rolleyes: I’m hoping to get to the point that I lose count… my mom and sister thought it funny that I was brimming with excitement to go to my “second-ever Latin Mass!” My third-ever hopefully tomorrow or someday soon. :extrahappy:

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