Which of these people will be in heaven?


#1

Based on what we can know about heaven from Bible and Tradition, give your opinion as to which of these is in or out or something in between.

a. John: Atheist. Model member of the community. Organizes food drives for poor, volunteers everywhere. Married 40 years. Kind and compassionate.

b. Mary: Divorced and remarried Catholic without annulment. Devoutly practices faith and is a pillar of the community.

c. Steve: Non-practicing Catholic. Believes in God. Nice, quiiet guy. Has not commited a mortal sin.

d. Suzy: Practicing liberal Catholic. Pro-Choice, married priest advocate, loves da Vinci Code.


#2

Any or all of them. None of us are insiders to that decision.


#3

It’s a pointless question since it asks us to make a ton of unknown presumptions that only God can make. Nobody’s life is as clear cut and simplistic as these peoples lives are. Any answer we give can be twisted around as judgmentalism.


#4

[quote=knute]Based on what we can know about heaven from Bible and Tradition, give your opinion as to which of these is in or out or something in between.

a. John: Atheist. Model member of the community. Organizes food drives for poor, volunteers everywhere. Married 40 years. Kind and compassionate.

b. Mary: Divorced and remarried Catholic without annulment. Devoutly practices faith and is a pillar of the community.

c. Steve: Non-practicing Catholic. Believes in God. Nice, quiiet guy. Has not commited a mortal sin.

d. Suzy: Practicing liberal Catholic. Pro-Choice, married priest advocate, loves da Vinci Code.
[/quote]

Can’t be determined as it is not our place.

a) john…but has he ever heard about Christ?
b) mary…does she know with absolute certainty that she is committing adultery in her remarriage?
c) steve…wrong scenario…if he isn’t a practicing Catholic then he has committed mortal sin by not attending mass or the sacraments.
d) suzy…obviously doesn’t really know what it means to be Catholic so she isn’t committing mortal sin. She’s certainly not making well-informed decisions, though.

All four can be saved upon their deaths depending on what is in their hearts at that moment.

Even the devout Catholic who attends daily mass, does good works, reconciliation every week, etc. is not assured a seat in heaven.


#5

[quote=Fidelis]It’s a pointless question since it asks us to make a ton of unknown presumptions that only God can make. Nobody’s life is as clear cut and simplistic as these peoples lives are. Any answer we give can be twisted around as judgmentalism.
[/quote]


Very good catch. I was thinking the same thing. When the first “judgment” would fly.


#6

Since this is just a hypothetical situation, we can make a judgement based on what we know. We can assume that the state of the hypothetical soul is what it appears to be. Of course, when it comes to real people in this situation, we cannot assume anything.

[quote=knute]a. John: Atheist. Model member of the community. Organizes food drives for poor, volunteers everywhere. Married 40 years. Kind and compassionate.
[/quote]

If they know what they’re doing yet don’t repent, not them. They try to make good works into God. See the 2nd Commandment.

[quote=knute]b. Mary: Divorced and remarried Catholic without annulment. Devoutly practices faith and is a pillar of the community.
[/quote]

If they know what they’re doing yet don’t repent, not them. They do not submit to the authority of the Church, and could be committing adultery. They think they know better than our God-given authority, and so try to put themselves above God. See the 1st and 6th commandments. See also the precept of the Church requiring Catholics to observe the Church’s marriage laws.

[quote=knute]c. Steve: Non-practicing Catholic. Believes in God. Nice, quiiet guy. Has not commited a mortal sin.
[/quote]

If they know what they’re doing yet don’t repent, not them. It is (objectively) a mortal sin for a Catholic not to practice their faith. See the 8th commandment, and all the precepts of the Church.

[quote=knute]d. Suzy: Practicing liberal Catholic. Pro-Choice, married priest advocate, loves da Vinci Code.
[/quote]

If they know what they’re doing yet don’t repent, not them. See the 1st, 2nd, and 5th commandments.


#7

With regard to the last scenario, and ignoring the pro-choice thing, I’m not sure that simply being in favor of a married priesthood is a sin in and of itself. Correct me if I’m wrong.

Also, to echo what others have said, we can never be sure of who is going to hell (except for Red Sox fans and the guy who designed the “It’s a Small World” ride in Disney). :smiley:


#8

[quote=knute]Based on what we can know about heaven from Bible and Tradition, give your opinion as to which of these is in or out or something in between.

a. John: Atheist. Model member of the community. Organizes food drives for poor, volunteers everywhere. Married 40 years. Kind and compassionate.

b. Mary: Divorced and remarried Catholic without annulment. Devoutly practices faith and is a pillar of the community.

c. Steve: Non-practicing Catholic. Believes in God. Nice, quiiet guy. Has not commited a mortal sin.

d. Suzy: Practicing liberal Catholic. Pro-Choice, married priest advocate, loves da Vinci Code.
[/quote]

None of them, because as the First Epistle to the Bolognians says, “You’re damned if you do, and damned if you don’t.”

See Also: Hell in a handbasket (Going to).


#9

“First Epistle to the Bolognians”??? I LOVE it!:smiley:


#10

This is one of the many reasons that I am Catholic. In my previous church, I was always being told who was and wasn’t going to hell. The fact of the matter is that none of us are God, so we have no right to judge.


#11

There is still too much that we don’t know. For example was the atheist brought up in a home in which religion was used as an excuse to abuse him(happens sometimes). In which case he has no knowledge of Jesus’ real love, so how can he reject something that he is unable to understand?

That is why we can’t judge for ourselves. We don’t know the inner workings of other humans, only God does.


#12

Stupid questions probably set by an atheist to bait Catholics.


#13

Unclear premis and poll. Thread closed.


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