Who is John MacArthur?

I surfed into this web site. ondoctrine.com/2mac0095.htm

Who is this man and how can someone be so misinformed?

I used to like the guy, found his “Grace to You” program on radio about 15 years ago, then I soon found out how anti-Catholic he is. His books “Gospel According to Jesus” and the sequel “Faith Works” are probably more helpful than his later books where he critiques Catholicism and the ECT documents. He also came out of the closet as a young-earther (10,000 years or less) and wrote a recent book on that called “Battle for the Beginning” (2001). So he’s got errors from all different directions. :slight_smile:

Anyway, testing the brand new Catholic Answers forums. Went with a PHP board I see…

Phil P

[quote=PhilVaz]IHe also came out of the closet as a young-earther (10,000 years or less) and wrote a recent book on that called “Battle for the Beginning” (2001). So he’s got errors from all different directions. :slight_smile:

Phil P
[/quote]

Haha, since when is that an error? :stuck_out_tongue:

<< Haha, since when is that an error? >>

Well, its been an error for at least 10 years when Dalrymple put his 500 page book out. Now you have no excuse… :stuck_out_tongue:

Evidence for Ancient Earth

MacArthur’s science arguments against an old earth are about as good as his biblical arguments against Catholicism. No, on second thought his biblical arguments are better… :rolleyes:

Phil P

[quote=PhilVaz]<< Haha, since when is that an error? >>

Well, its been an error for at least 10 years when Dalrymple put his 500 page book out. Now you have no excuse… :stuck_out_tongue:

Evidence for Ancient Earth

MacArthur’s science arguments against an old earth are about as good as his biblical arguments against Catholicism. No, on second thought his biblical arguments are better… :rolleyes:

Phil P
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I guess I quoted wrongly. I should’ve said, since when is being a Youeng Earth Creationist is an error :wink:

Hey hey don’t quote entire messages back. Young earth creationism is an error scientifically, not necessarily biblically. Don’t get me started on that topic, we just got here… :eek:

[quote=PhilVaz]Hey hey don’t quote entire messages back. Young earth creationism is an error scientifically, not necessarily biblically. Don’t get me started on that topic, we just got here… :eek:
[/quote]

But there can be no scientific error that is Biblically correct :stuck_out_tongue:

159 Faith and science: “Though faith is above reason, there can never be any real discrepancy between faith and reason. Since the same God who reveals mysteries and infuses faith has bestowed the light of reason on the human mind, God cannot deny himself, nor can truth ever contradict truth.” “Consequently, methodical research in all branches of knowledge, provided it is carried out in a truly scientific manner and does not override moral laws, can never conflict with the faith, because the things of the world and the things of faith derive from the same God. The humble and persevering investigator of the secrets of nature is being led, as it were, by the hand of God in spite of himself, for it is God, the conserver of all things, who made them what they are.”

<< But there can be no scientific error that is Biblically correct >>

You’re right, I worded that wrong. Okay its official, today everybody leaves Steve Ray’s board and joins up here. This is the new “hot” board. :thumbsup: What would make it even greater is if each person can “save” their own color scheme, and color this board and messages however they like. To do that, add a couple more fields to your MySQL database or whatever. :confused:

Phil P

[quote=PhilVaz]<< But there can be no scientific error that is Biblically correct >>

You’re right, I worded that wrong. Okay its official, today everybody leaves Steve Ray’s board and joins up here. This is the new “hot” board. :thumbsup: What would make it even greater is if each person can “save” their own color scheme, and color this board and messages however they like. To do that, add a couple more fields to your MySQL database or whatever. :confused:

Phil P
[/quote]

Who said I was leaving DCF? :stuck_out_tongue:

[quote=DJB]I surfed into this web site. ondoctrine.com/2mac0095.htm

Who is this man and how can someone be so misinformed?
[/quote]

To return us to the thread at hand, John MacArthur is the head pastor at Grace Community Church here in Southern California (Sun Valley). He is broadcast here in San Diego at 8 a.m., so I get to hear him fairly often. The biggest issue with him is not so much that he teaches a lot of error, but rather his ego. If you listen to him over time, as I have, I suspect that you would be amazed at the amount of pride that he has. I think this pride, as pride does for all of us, blinds him from the truth.

Granted, not everything he teaches is wrong, but a lot has subtle shades of error built in.

I believe that Rosalind Moss, in her Evangelical days, was a member of MacArthur’s congregation. Perhaps Ros will share some observations on him.

Hey Karl, great board. My guess is MacArthur doesn’t study the views he opposes. For example, he quotes from “ex-priests” and Lorraine Boettner in that article above. I doubt he’s read the Catechism since that would clear up a lot of basic mistakes. But he’s not unintelligent, I’ve listened to him on radio for years. His ministry site is www.GTY.org

Here is an evangelical response to MacArthur on his young earth views

Phil P

[quote=PhilVaz]You’re right, I worded that wrong. Okay its official, today everybody leaves Steve Ray’s board and joins up here.

[/quote]

Naah, DCF is my home board. :slight_smile:

[quote=PhilVaz]I used to like the guy, found his “Grace to You” program on radio about 15 years ago, then I soon found out how anti-Catholic he is. His books “Gospel According to Jesus” and the sequel “Faith Works” are probably more helpful than his later books where he critiques Catholicism and the ECT documents.
[/quote]

That book should be titled “Gospel According to my interpretation of Jesus” since he confuses his personal interpretation of scripture to scripture itself.

As far as I remember, there’s nothing objectionable to Catholicism in those two MacArthur books (The Gospel According to Jesus, and Faith Works now called The Gospel According to the Apostles), and in fact much in those books would coincide with what Jimmy Akin writes in The Salvation Controversy. Not that I would recommend MacArthur, there’s too much good Catholic stuff to read. :thumbsup:

Phil P

[quote=DJB]I surfed into this web site. ondoctrine.com/2mac0095.htm

Who is this man and how can someone be so misinformed?
[/quote]

Wow, John MacArthur at gty.org/ is one of my most loved teachers I listen to on the radio daily! :thumbsup:

His sermons are taught in an expository way, the way I teach, and I always learn something from His teachings from Scripture that I sometimes miss. :cool:

John MacArthur is one of the most active anti-Catholics on the planet. He regularly hosts anti-Catholic groups like "Missions to Catholics’ and “Christians Evangelizing Catholics” at his home “church” in Sun Valley. He has written anti-Catholic books and written forewards for anti-Catholic books by others. Even in his study Bible he goes out of it’s way to target Catholic teachings and treat them in a dismissive manner (for example the footnotes on Luke 1:28 and Matthew 16:18, for two of the most blatant). I’ve known several people who have been suckered out of the Church to join Grace Community. Whatever talents he may have as a preacher and Bible teacher, he is definitely not a friend to Catholics.

If anyone is interested, here is a copy of a letter I just sent John MacArthur…

As a lifelong Protestant who has been called to the Catholic Church along with my family (and others close to me), I wanted to take a moment to voice my disappointment in your writings against the Catholic Church and its tradition. I grew-up listening to your tapes and found them helpful and comforting as a child. My grandmother loved listening to you on the radio in the afternoons. I always had enjoyed your expository preaching, and I grew-up frequently hearing your voice. This being the case, I was particularly dismayed to read your sermon railing against the Catholic priesthood. The series of events which led my family to explore this tradition highlights the lack of sound doctrine and understanding within parts of the Protestant Church today. As a pastor in a Free Methodist Church exclaimed in a service we attended earlier this year, “Martin Luther’s existence was as important as the birth of Christ.” This is blasphemy–on several levels. Not to mention that the pastor was castigating the Catholic Church for the sins of the Episcopal Church; he couldn’t even grasp the distinction. The lack of depth in some Protestant churches is downright frightening, but one can still sense an undercurrent even there, a desire for unity as Christians.

One of your first allegations that Mary is seen as the Co-redemptrix is like saying that all Protestants believe that only white males should be permitted to vote. It may hold true for one small church in northeastern Idaho, but it is a misrepresentation of Protestants as a whole. Likewise, you misrepresent the billion Catholics in the world who worship Christ in His church. You take a quick glance at Catholic teachings and doctrines, and you spin them to your own meaning and purpose. You are opposing the unity Saint Paul and the Gospels set forth as a model.

As a writer and someone who has had several long letters published lately in Christianity Today, I urge you to keep your eyes out for my next piece in CT. If the magazine graciously prints it, I ask you to consider one facet alone (for now) of the diamond which is the Catholic Church…the facet reflecting what it means to respect life at all stages. Protestants are unequipped to approach this debate in an intellectually honest manner. I urge you to give it some thought, because I know you have the power through Christ to be the man He wants you to be. You don’t have to be divisive anymore. To paraphrase Saint Augustine, there is one church, the Catholic Church. As long as you are a Christian, you are a member of sorts of this church–whether you appreciate this fact, or not.

Writer,

I’ve read and listened to Dr. John MacArthur for a long time. I consider him a great man of God - pastor, teacher, author, and theologian. That being said, I would like to look at some of the things you said in your letter.

[quote=Writer]As a lifelong Protestant who has been called to the Catholic Church along with my family (and others close to me), I wanted to take a moment to voice my disappointment in your writings against the Catholic Church and its tradition…

[/quote]

I would like to know what particular “writings” are you referring to here? Regarding your disappointment I have two questions: Are you dissapointed 1) due to the fact that he is not a Roman Catholic and has gone public (following his pastoral conscience) in pointing out the errors of the Roman Church? Or, 2) are you dissapointed due to the substance of his teaching against Catholicism? There is a difference, for example, in my being disappointed that Karl Keating has written a book at all against protestantism and my being disappointed in the substance of his book against protestantism. (I have no problem with Mr. Keating writing a book against protestantism - he has every right to follow his conscience. My feelings on the substance of his book is another matter :rolleyes: .)

[quote=Writer]I was particularly dismayed to read your sermon railing against the Catholic priesthood…
[/quote]

What was so disappointing?

[quote=Writer]One of your first allegations that Mary is seen as the Co-redemptrix is like saying that all Protestants believe that only white males should be permitted to vote…
[/quote]

That belief is quite strong in Catholicism, especially in Latin America. He didn’t say that was official Catholic doctrine, but many do hold to that view.

[quote=Writer]Likewise, you misrepresent the billion Catholics in the world who worship Christ in His church. You take a quick glance at Catholic teachings and doctrines, and you spin them to your own meaning and purpose. You are opposing the unity Saint Paul and the Gospels set forth as a model.
[/quote]

So you’re claiming Dr. MacArthur misrepresents the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church? Where is the documentation to back up your assertions? As far as the “unity” comment above, when it comes to the gospel, there is no compromise (cf. Galatians 1:6-9 and see Paul’s reaction). Remember, according to Trent, protestants (those who believe in sola fide, for example) are under the anathema of Rome. At least both sides agree, there can be no “unity” with what is believed to be falsehood.

Dr. John MacArthur’s website: www.gty.org
Also, Dr. MacArthur is the President of The Master’s Seminary (www.tms.edu) in Sun Valley, California.

As a Protestant myself, I find MacArthur helpful.

One of his attractive points, (which doesn’t attract me), is his absolute certainty about every view he holds. This approach appeals to a high percentage of people. I would not call it pride, though.

He is seldom called “Dr. MacArthur.” He earned an M.Div. at Talbot. The doctorates are merely honorary. The web site usually calls him “John.”

Nobody gets credibility by completing a doctorate; he gets credibility by performing. MacArthur stand or falls by his books, tapes, pastoring, and personal holiness. If the quality and value are there, it adds nothing to refer to his honorary or real degrees. :yawn:

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