That’s my point. Catholics say Catholicism is the fullness of the truth. Protestants say their denomination is the fullness of the truth. Both believe their statements, which is why it can be difficult to have exchanges that don’t end in upset or anger at the end of it. My advice to the OP is built on that - remember that he holds his beliefs as dear to him as you do to you. Work from that standing point because it will give your conversations a foundation of respect.
As an ex-protestant here, who is now Catholic, I remember as a protestant we did not say we had the fullness of truth but that all protestants together had some truth and when we reach heaven God would let us know who was right about what and who was wrong about what. In other words, it wouldn’t be until we reach heaven that we would find out which protestants were right and which ones were wrong.
That’s really interesting, thanks. I’ve only ever heard the phrase “fullness of the truth” used by Catholics, which is why I used it to describe how the man most likely feels about his own beliefs. I guess a better way to put it is that both the OP and the man have the same conviction of beliefs, it’s just that the contents of those beliefs are different.
It is about vain repetition that the Bible see as a problem. Jesus Christ taught us to pray the “Our Father” and are we supposed to do that only once? Of course not, but when we race through it just because we are told to pray it, especially if we want everyone to see us when praying, then it becomes vain.
Maybe the protestant man would like to join you as you read the mysteries of the Rosary and meditate on them instead of praying all of the Hail Mary´s. A very wise old priest told me to go for a 15-20 minute walk and meditate on the mysteries instead of praying the Rosary with other people. They were speeding (I couldn’t pronounce the words at that speed.) through it before Mass and I would just get worked up as they didn’t pray in unison. I’ve been Catholic for four years now and I still avoid praying the Rosary with other people even though they have slowed down a lot in my parish now.
A better question is why are particular Protestants ignorant of Catholic teachings, and usually the answer is because no one told them what Catholics actually believe. The other answer to that is up to you to find out, by engaging them in dialogue, and figure out how they came to think Catholicism is evil etc., usually a little logic and reason will snap them out of their biases.
I’ll just point out that it goes both ways. Your average cradle Catholic, heck probably even your average devout cradle Catholic, doesn’t know a whole lot about Protestantism either.
You don’t know what you don’t know. And you also don’t know that you don’t know it! A devout friend of mine told me she didn’t know prots didn’t pray the Hail Mary or believe in transubstantiation. She’s not the only one I’ve heard such things from.
Protestants and Catholics are both told erroneous things about eachothers beliefs for their entire lives. Even as a convert I don’t feel qualified to speak on every issue as to what my old church believes. I simply wasn’t as educated in that church as I am now in Catholicism.
A fellow convert once told me that all Protestants believe in “once saved always saved”
In conclusion, people simply don’t know as much as they think they do in general, but in particular when it comes to something as nuanced a as theology they’ve never personally studied.
Everyone is ignorant of any number of things, mostly because they have not have the opportunity to learn about them. You had the opportunity to teach, but you choose to call him stupid instead.
Good for you for saying the Rosary so that others can see and question. Use it as a teaching moment. Beads for counting prayers are not unique to Catholicism, not by a long shot. They are helpful in meditation, and we meditate on the mysteries of salvation. Tell the guy this and answer his other questions. Then keep praying the Rosary.
The Catholic Church has the fullness of “Revealed Truth,” not the fullness of truth being there there is so much we don’t know.
Yes that is true
I like to study history on order to understand present events.
The Protestant Reformation was partly about individualism and no need to obey human institutions. One of the core message is that it cuts out the middle man. Everyone had direct access to God. So anything that “seems” to have a middle man is deemed unnecessary. Eg Hierarchical Church, priests for confession, intercession of saints etc. hence the rosary.
So it’s not that they are ignorant or stupid, their religion is based on precisely that specific notion.
Hence what good is tracing through human institution when you can believe directly in the Word of God? would be their thinking I think.
This also partly explains why the Northern European cultures became more Protestant, because the Germanic Anglo Saxon Scandinavian cultures are more individualistic whereas the Southern European cultures are more collectivist.
That is why there is great deal to be lost in China without a Vatican China deal. Asians tend to be collectivist than individualist and people also revere history and culture. Ultimately I think Catholicism would appeal much more than Protestantism and it has been for centuries in China…Catholics outnumbered Protestants. But now Protestants outnumbers Catholics by a lot. If only the bishop ordination issue can be sorted out perhaps like Vietnam model. Catholicism is booming there.
Probably is not a good idea to assume that OP did not use it as a teaching moment. They do not really say how the conversation went. I do not get the impression OP called him stupid at that time or to his face, but asked a question of fellow Catholics, trying to help them understand why protestants do not understand Catholicism. OP perhaps used the wrong word in their post but that is all.
OP page also says they lives in India, could be an English grammar difference.
Do I understand you correctly, that you believe that Protestants do not understand Catholicism because they are stupid?
I think Protestants are more likely to believe they are correct and the Catholic Church is evil because they are called “Protest-ants”. They protested the Catholic Church, and their rebellion signifies that whatever the Catholic Church teaches, many will have a problem with, whatever that might be. That’s why there’s so many different denominations. There’s so many different things to protest about. The one thing they all have in common is that they all disagree with the Church.
I’m curious where you got these ideas… Many non-Catholic Christians think very little about the Reformation. Reformed Christians just commemorated 500 years since Martin Luther hung up the 95 theses at Wittenburg and many Lutheran church leaders (such as the Archbishop of Sweden) met with the Pope to mark this anniversary. There is not a lot of protesting going on these days, Most leaders are very friendly with each other.
Some Christians are very anti-Catholic. This is quite true, Some Christians are very cordial to the RCC. Some pay no attention to it at all. I don’t understand what you mean when you say that because there are so many things to protest about the Catholics, that is why there are so many denominations. That statement seems rather confusing to me.
Anyway, I wouldn’t worry about it too much. Those of us outside the Catholic Church are mostly quite happy with our Church and our relationship with Jesus. We scratch our head over some of the things coming out of YOUR closets, but that is another topic entirely.
No. You are focusing too much on OP poor choice of words. They are only asking why do protestants not understand Catholicism. I use to be protestant and understand exactly what they are asking and do not feel insulted at all.
It’s been indicated in the earlier posts of this thread that the OP Is in India and likely has English as a second language, and is probably not aware of the nuances of the words they used.
It is also likely that the man who aggressively tried to proselytize to her does not understand the beliefs and practices of the Catholic faith and made statements and assumptions that are not correct and that are frankly offensive to a Catholic. The OP doesn’t understand why the Protestant would have these really wrong assumptions.
The thread isn’t about you all being “happy with your Church and your relationship with Jesus”. The thread is about a Protestant aggressively proselytizing his faith to a Catholic who is not interested. If he wants to be happy with his own faith, then he can go do that, but he also needs to leave the Catholic alone to be happy with his or her faith.
misstherese’s viewpoint that all Protestants have one thing in common, that they disagree with the Catholic Church, is true. Regardless of whether a Protestant is “cordial” or is “anti-Catholic”, they DO disagree with the Catholic Church on some things, or they would be Catholic.
It’s not exactly “protesting” but I used the word to connect it to the origin of Protestantism. I know a lot of Protestants don’t really care much for the Reformation anymore, but many do still disagree with the Church, but on other issues. I even know of a lot of Protestants who, before converting to Catholicism, viewed the Catholic Church as their last stop, out of all religions. Something that all of their friends agreed on: that they disliked the Catholic Church. Others called it the Whore of Babylon. Of course, this isn’t every Protestant. Everyone disagrees in different ways. Some are very friendly to the Catholic Faith, but they still disagree. All of these disagreements stem from the origin of Protestantism, the mindset.
Based on the context of the OPs use of the word, there’s no reason to believe that he does not know what it means. “Stupid” is not a very nuanced word. It really only means one thing. “Aggressive” apparently means more than one thing though.