Wasn’t sure how to word the title…
Anyway, I’d like to know why it is that the scriptures seem to have been frozen in time. What I mean is that the OT has an abundance of examples of God talking to leaders and prophets but for most of the last 2000 years there is silence. The reason for my question is that It challenges my faith because I can’t help but feel that it suggests that Christianity was born from an era where mankind was superstitious, and maybe even inclined towards pagan the bewilderment of the world. Now that we are scientifically knowledgeable, the interactions with God have trailed off. I mean, why doesn’t He keep in touch like he used to?
Wasn’t sure how to word the title…
Jesus is the fullness of God’s revelation.
And the Church, instituted by Christ, on Peter and his successors, and inspired and guided by the Holy Spirit, continually clarifies and teaches.
God actually only had one word to say…JESUS…and He has nothing more to say.
The OT was constantly pointing towards the Messiah…That was the point. Once the Messiah came and said what needed to be said and the Church received the total deposit of the faith, that was it because that’s all we needed. He’s not a babbler and wont keep talking just to satisfy new and more sophisticated generations.
Would you mind elaborating on that please?
See the Catechism section on Divine Revelation or the Vatican II document Dei Verbum.
“…mankind was superstitious…” You believe mankind is no longer superstitious? The divine presence hasn’t stopped talking to mankind mankind has stopped listening for the most part.
I don’t know the “why”, only that it happened once public revelation was complete. I think one of the issues of CA magazine has an article on this.
…ever wonder why people stop talking “baby-talk” to their infants as they enter the toddler stage?
…or have you noticed how there’s a time (with the exception of some overly protective/fanatical agents) when a baby is waned from liquid nourishment and transitioned to solids?
…that’s how we can understand the spiritual trek of humanity.
…just as the Hebrew trek through the desert (living in tents rather then fixed buildings), man has been on a sojourn and as he has developed so has his relationship with God… man’s odyssey in search of his final destination has taken him from a state where he is fully flesh and bone with hidden spiritual cognition to a state of heightened spiritual awareness…
…during the Old Testament God spoke to man–a few, very specific specimen; as God’s Salvific Plan came into the Fullness of Revelation (New Testament, the Incarnation of the Word) God abides with and in man (the Church and individual Believers).
…man has been risen from a fully flesh and bone creature to a son of God, with the benefits and Graces that a conscious spiritual man is Granted:
[FONT=“Garamond”][size=]12 But as many as received him, he gave them power to be made the sons of God, to them that believe in his name. 13 Who are born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
(St. John 1:12-13)
16 And I will ask the Father, and he shall give you another Paraclete, that he may abide with you for ever. 17 The spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, nor knoweth him: but you shall know him; because he shall abide with you, and shall be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans, I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while: and the world seeth me no more. But you see me: because I live, and you shall live. 20 In that day you shall know, that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them; he it is that loveth me. And he that loveth me, shall be loved of my Father: and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. 22 Judas saith to him, not the Iscariot: Lord, how is it, that thou wilt manifest thyself to us, and not to the world? 23 Jesus answered, and said to him: If any one love me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him, and will make our abode with him. (St. John 14:16-23)
…man has been moved closer to God:
20 Our fathers adored on this mountain, and you say, that at Jerusalem is the place where men must adore. 21 Jesus saith to her: Woman, believe me, that the hour cometh, when you shall neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, adore the Father. 22 You adore that which you know not: we adore that which we know; for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him. 24 God is a spirit; and they that adore him, must adore him in spirit and in truth.
(St. John 4:20-24)
… in expectation of that final encounter with God:
1 Behold what manner of charity the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called, and should be the sons of God. Therefore the world knoweth not us, because it knew not him. 2 Dearly beloved, we are now the sons of God; and it hath not yet appeared what we shall be. We know, that, when he shall appear, we shall be like to him: because we shall see him as he is.
(1 St. John 3:1-2)
Well it seems to me that there were quite a few people who experienced intimate experiences with God where He instructed them to do various things. These experiences were very real for the people receiving them. As they are depicted in the Bible, it would be inconceivable for somebody not to listen if they found themselves on the receiving end.
However, since the Bible was compiled, there seems to have been no new instances of God choosing a person to interact with in a similar manner. I don’t understand why not really.
Many would point to Hebrews 1:1-2 which goes something like “In the past God spoke to our fathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things.”
So the belief is that, as others have pointed out, Jesus is the final “Prophet,” thus closing the Heavens making further revelation from above unnecessary. I may have over-simplified that a little, but short of a 30 page Theological treatise, you get the “jist” of what I’m saying right?
Other groups, such as the Latter Day Saints do still believe that God can speak to humanity through modern day Prophets.
Thanks for that. yes, I get the gist of what is being said. Unfortunately, I am not a well-read/educated RC, being as I am somewhat lapsed. I am not looking to challenge; rather to overcome one of those tiresome niggles that are capable of leaking the “faith energy” for the more uninformed faithful such as I
He has said and given us all we need for salvation there is nothing more to be said (revealed). We now live by faith. Actually God still speaks to us through private revelation and even events and graces given us individually. He doesn’t reveal anything new just reminds us of what He has already said.
And, in prayer, with the gift of discernment, we can understand what the Lord is saying to us.
Well, I suppose that another slant on my query might be this: God spoke to Moses et al , assisting the Jews to find liberation from their oppressors and to return to the Promised Land. I should have thought that there was sufficient cause for him to do the same today. I know that the similarity with the banishment and subjugation to Egypt, the Egyptians and the subsequent forty years in the desert is not the same but the Jews must surely seek an end to the strife in their homeland and an end to the bloodshed as well as the restoration of the Temple. So why no appearances/interventions as of old?
Apologies for any ill-informed questions/statement but as already stated, I am not so academically trained with Biblical history.
God has always remained with us in the Blessed Sacrament since that time. We can converse with Him anytime we like. . . Awesome !
Yet even then, St Padre Pio interacted with people on God’s behalf, often mystically.
St. André Bessette would be another example, yet in all the physical healings brought about through him/his prayers , he always concentrated on the well-being of the soul.
The Curé of Ars would be another.
I don’t say this in an attempt to be anti-Semitic or anything of the lot, but essentially, the temple in Jerusalem doesn’t need to be restored because its no longer necessary. Essentially the Jewish faith, representing the old covenant is null and void…a new Covenant of coures existing through Jesus. I would send you back to the book of Hebrews. The first ten chapters are filled with the imagery and explanation as to why the old covenant and the temple is not necessary.
Is it so much that God has stopped talking to us, is it that we are no longer listening, or perhaps, we are blinded and deafened by all of the sound and fury around us such that we no longer hear the Lord in the whisper of the wind…
[11 (D.R. Translation] And he said to him: Go forth, and stand upon the mount before the Lord: and behold the Lord passeth, and a great and strong wind before the Lord over throwing the mountains, and breaking the rocks in pieces: the Lord is not in the wind, and after the wind an earthquake: the Lord is not in the earthquake.  And after the earthquake a fire: the Lord is not in the fire, and after the fire a whistling of a gentle air.  And when Elias heard it, he covered his face with his mantle, and coming forth stood in the entering in of the cave, and behold a voice unto him, saying: What dost thou here, Elias?
There are modern day miracles
CNA: The modern – and little known – miracles of Padre Pio
bringing suitcase of prayers to Rome**cured by John Paul II **
CNA - Saint’s relic with miraculous tendencies does it again for Pope Francis
and Private Revelation (CA Tract)
least we forget, as others have stated in this thread, there is the Magisterium of the Church… thru which the Lord is constantly talking to us -
however, these things and events are lost in the maelstrom of the Presidential Elections in the USA, violence around the world, climate change, and so forth…
The Lord is Speaking to us; however, sadly, all to often, many of us don’t hear is voice…
(yes, quite often, I don’t hear him as I should… easy to fall victim to the world’s noise. :sad_yes: )
Hebrews 1: 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high…
[FONT=“Book Antiqua”]**I cannot agree that YHWH has not spoken to anyone in the last 1000 years. He has communicated to His various saints many times.
You have only to read biographies such as “The Little Flowers of St. Francis” to see this.
In addition, we have the famous (or infamous) Prophecy of the Popes together with the visions of Pope St. Pius X.
These indicate an event that must take place at Vatican City within the lifetime of Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI.
I think that YHWH speaks to us all the time. Perhaps we just don’t know how to listen. **[/FONT]