Why did Mary specifically mention Russia in Fatima?

In the Fatima apparitions Mary told the children about Russia potentially spreading her errors throughout the world. Many believe she (Russia) is doing that now.

I just wondered why Mary would mentioned Russia specifically, a big communist power, and not a different communist power like China? Why not give a few countries as examples? Some of the things going on in China more recently are arguably worse than what is going on in Russia.

It’s easy to see how many patriotic Russians would look at this message from Mary as anti-Russian political propaganda from the Catholic Church.

To clarify, I don’t think that’s the case and I believe what happened in Fatima and what Mary said, but to pick one specific communist atheist country in the world, when there are others, and as far as big powerful countries go, might seem unusual to some, and is likely to be refuted by many Russians as Russophobic propaganda.

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The Fatima apparitions occurred in 1917. It’s pretty easy to see why Russia was the main focus.

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I think most private revelations have some sort of bearing on or relationship to immediate contemporaneous current affairs to maintain relevancy: reveal too far and too ambiguously into the future and it might have no meaning for the witnesses.

At the time of the Fatima apparitions, the Russian Revolution had just occurred (Nicholas abdicated on 15 March, first apparition on 13 May). The Communist Party of China wasn’t to be founded for another 4 or so years, and the PRC wasn’t established until 1949.

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@Polak

Kindness is a virtue but a delirious apprehension of hurting somebody’s feelings is not.

If a Russian person wants to be upset by Fatima, you just have to accept the fact that it is a conscious choice which they are choosing to make. Similar warnings came about France prior to the French Revolution. If a Parisian wanted to be upset by that, that isn’t something within your control to stop. We can’t control how other people feel or the choices that other people make.

Peace.

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@Polak
The “errors of Russia”, which Our Lady spoke about in her apparition was the evil of atheistic materialism, which has its origins in Communist Russia, not in China or any other country (they have accepted it from Russia).

Unfortunately the errors of Russia have been spread all over the world, or has been stopped only partially - the whole Western World is bathing now in cultural Marxism and sin stemming from it. This is what Pope Benedict XVI spoke about in 2010 in Fatima. He said then that ‘it would be deluding to think that the prophetic mission of Fatima is over’. He made it clear that this revelation is still relevant, because the call to conversion and penance is relevant.

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The Communist regime in China was thirty years in the future. Russia – not yet renamed the USSR or Soviet Union – was, at that time, the only communist country in the world.

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The Immaculate Heart of Mary is known from the Wedding Feast at Cana (John 2: 1-12) when she tells the steward, “Do whatever he tells you.” referring the her son Jesus. But also from her virtuous qualities such as being pure, prudent, humble, faithful, devote, obedient, poor, patient, merciful, and sorrowful, all attested to in scripture. Qualities that everyone should have and pray for, to prevent errors.

Some history between 1914 and 1922:

  • Russia and its allies (Britain and France) in war with Ottoman empire, WWI 1914 - 1918
    1 November 1914 Russia, 5 November 1914 Britain and France
  • February Revolution - March 8, 1917
  • Miracle of the Sun (Fatima) - October 13, 1917
  • Bolshevik Revolution - November 6 and 7, 1917
  • 1918 End of WWI: Austro-Hungarian, German, Ottoman, and Russian Empires ended
  • 1918 to 1920 Russian Civil War between Red and White armies.
  • 1921-1922 Russian Famine
  • 1921 Chinese Communist Party founded (Marxism–Leninism)
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And, as someone else said above, China and other Communist countries took their cue from Russia.

Russia did indeed “spread its errors throughout the world”, just as Our Lady said.

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So Russia spread its errors to China (and other nations since). That makes more sense. I knew The CCP had ruled in China for a long time and that China has long been a communist country, but I didn’t realise it wasn’t yet at that time.

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Excerpt from history of CCP on Wikipedia:

The CCP has its origins in the May Fourth Movement of 1919, during which radical Western ideologies like Marxism and anarchism gained traction among Chinese intellectuals.[20] Other influences stemming from the Bolshevik revolution and Marxist theory inspired the Communist Party of China.[21] Li Dazhao was the first leading Chinese intellectual who publicly supported Leninism and world revolution.[22] In contrast to Chen Duxiu, Li did not renounce participation in the affairs of the Republic of China.[23] Both of them regarded the October Revolution in Russia as groundbreaking, believing it to herald a new era for oppressed countries everywhere.[23]
The CCP was modeled on Vladimir Lenin’s theory of a vanguard party.[24] Study circles were, according to Cai Hesen, “the rudiments [of our party]”.[25]

Because if Russia hadn’t fallen to communism, communism never would have spread to China or others. It was the first domino.

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Yeah, communism successfully rose to power in Russia.

The fascists of WW2 also created an opportune vacuum for communists to spread. The Chinese nationalist army was in a prolonged war of survival against imperial Japan and the Chinese communist army remained isolated further inland throughout the ordeal.

Germany annexing the Balkans and Eastern Europe and then subsequently getting obliterated by the Soviet Union allowed communism to move deep into Europe.

Thank you for those dates, @Vico. I see I made a serious mistake in my earlier post. At the time of the Fatima apparitions (from May 13 till October 13, 1917) Lenin’s Bolsheviks had not yet seized power in Russia. That didn’t happen until the night of November 7-8. In the May-October period, Russia was still governed by Kerensky’s Social Democrats, who had been in power since the czar was forced to abdicate on March 15.

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The Orthodox generally put not stock in these revelations and they are meaningless to them. Insisting on ‘conversions of Russia’ using them goes nowhere.

Are you referring to Orthodox Catholics, traditional and conservative, or the Eastern Orthodox Church?

I think there is an Orthodox area here, Eastern. One could make the statement you did about Baptists and LDS too. Not sure what the purpose of that was.

EO- my wife was totally unfamiliar with Fatima before I knew her and if forms no part of her faith and most EO have little interest in it. Among those who do know or think about it, which tend to be the clergy or religious nerds like us lot here there are a range of opinions. These range from, ‘The events unfolding in Russia were ongoing and the kids were repeating their elders views to some extent’ to ‘What actually appeared at Fatima, was it the Theotokos or something else?’ The latter tends to be the preserve of those more likely to engage in polemics mind you. The latter also tend to view Fatima as yet another attempt to assert Papal supremacy over the Orthodox. But for the most part most Russians just don’t think about it, it’s not important to them in any way.

That’s not not Orthodox, that is an Eastern Catholic sub-section of the forum. There was once long ago an Orthodox sub-forum on CAF, it was beset by endless polemic arguments and fights and vanished as a result.

Not sure the parents would have been that concerned with events unfolding in Russia. I would have thought they’d have hundreds of other things to talk about before even considering the politics of a far away country.

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Mega dittos to that.

As I understand it, Jacinta did not know what Russia even was. She thought it was the name of a little girl.

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