If Muslims believe that the Scriptures have been corrupted, why do I always see them arguing from them (Scriptures)? For example, I always see Muslims quoting Scripture to try and prove that Jesus is not God, but how can they expect to prove something from corrupted texts?
OHHH…that is a great question…cant wait to hear the answer:)
easy…what agrees with Quran is not corrupt…what disagrees is corrupt…very conveniant
Muhammad produced no miracles and when pressed he claimed that his miracle is the Quran. Yet a cursory look at the Quran reveals that this book is full of errors. Quran is full of scientific errors, heresies, historic blunders, mathematical mistakes, logical absurdities, grammatical errors and ethical fallacies. It is badly compiled and it contradicts itself. There is nothing intelligent in this book let alone miraculous. Muhammad challenged people to produce a “Surah like it” or find an error therein, yet Muslims would kill anyone who dares to criticize it. In such a climate of hypocrisy and violence truth is the first casualty.
Unfortunately, such Muslims are hypocrites (munafiq) and they are only using our Scriptures to discredit our faith.
It actually makes sense to me.
Imagine for a moment that you believe that Jane Eyre is the be all and end all of literature and I believe that Tom Sawyer holds that distinction. Naturally, to save you from your misconceptions, I want to change your mind. Now I could pull out all the great things about Twain’s work to prove that he is a much better writer, or I could show you the weak spots of your favorite.
If I use your book to discredit your belief, it shows sevearl things. I have studied Jane Eyre to the point of knowing where it is lacking. I respect your point of view to the point of studying the book you think is so great. I have come to the conclusion that it is not as good as mine. I am willing to show you its weak points.
Another analogy: you like shrimp and I like steak. I could tell you that steak tastes better, or I could point out that shrimp is rubbery and stinks. I could show you all the great ways to prepare steak, or I could remind you that shrimp eat the waste of other sea animals.
In either scenario, I am sowing the seeds of interest and sparking questions in your own mind. I don’t absolutely have to get you to agree that my way is right, just get you to admit that your way is wrong. Then I can work on showing you the beauty of my own book or the savor of my favorite meat.
Just a note: We can use the same methods to spread Catholicism.
hello… Muslims, are you there? At least dhimi would be fine to explain…
To convince us by using arguments from sources we accept ?
The trouble is, that idea breaks down on the fact that they don’t accept the Bible in any principled way - but only when it suits them to do so. They argue that there is corruption not by looking at specific texts & discussing them in detail, but because their apologetic requires this or that verse, or these verses, to be corrupt. And that is irrational. One cannot say “Verse X is corrupt” if there is no justification for saying so except the needs of one’s argument - otherwise those who want evidence that this is the case, having nothing to go on but the assertion of the Muslim. Which is the fallacy of ipsedixitism. ##
Why do Muslims argue from Scripture?
Because Muslims are humans and humans argue.
The problem, as I see it, is that any scripture they quote could be one of the corrupted passages. It’s as though I gave you a table of logarithms (remember those?!) where you claimed half the entries were corrupted, but nobody knew which half. No matter what calculations you did using those values to prove my theories wrong, I could always say “no, you got the wrong answer because you used a corrupted value” and how could you dispute that, since your fundamental premise is that the table is corrupted?
There was a Muslim here a couple days ago who argued that, since I am not Muslim and hence do not believe Islamic scripture, I have no right to use Islamic scripture to evidence my claims.
Then he went and quoted the Bible despite not being a Christian nor believing in the ‘corrupt’ Bible.
Truly a miracle of Allah that one.
Interesting. It is certainly OK for a Muslim to use the bible, or a Christian to use the Quran, to attempt to say “you believe this” or “your faith teaches this”. But one should not act like, and argue as though, the scripture of the other faith is inspired by God if one does not believe it to be.
hello… Muslims, are you there? At least dhimi would be fine to explain…
Come on, that sort of remark is unacceptable. I am offended for our Moslem brothers and sisters. Insult is wrong. It is not God-like.
Jesus never insulted. Everything He taught was in support of love and the love of God. The ony thing that He taught that was not, was man’s love of mammon.
In Christ, we should extend the hand of friendship:thumbsup:
Oh please…there was no insult in that:)
No Muslim is going to respond to this?
Sixtus my brother in Christ, I didnt insult anyone. I just merely ask the muslims or you perhaps could explain the question of OP. If I called the muslims Pagan worsippers, then they may feel insulted.
Get the point?
SO said that to me when i quoted the contradictions in the koran. That argument is so absurd.
if a muslim can quote the bible as evidence of flaws in Christianity, then it is reasonable for me to quote the Koran as evidence of flaws in Islam. That’s a quid pro quo. Anything else is hypocrisy.
The reason that muslim use the bible to ‘prove’ that christianity is a load of rubbish is because they can’t use their own holy book. The reasons for this is:
muslims are not taught to look their religion critically. They are merely taught to believe everything in the koran, no matter how contradictory. So in debates with unbelievers like me, they are unable to come up with concrete arguments using their own beliefs and holy book, preferring to resort to the old chestnuts ;’ U don’t understand our faith’, ‘u r not muslim so u can’t use our koran’, or ‘interpretations of the holy book can only be done by a suitably qualified islamic scholar…’ this doesn’t work they’ll claim i’m attacking their faith in a bid to kill discussion.
muslims are usually taught the flaws of everyone else’s faith so as to convert pple or justify seeing other pple and other faiths as inferior to their own. This method of teaching clearly lacks depth (e.g muslims are never taught how Christians view the trinity) so cannot formulate good arguments against Christian practices. So their arguments can be torn apart quite easily.
muslims often read books that criticise Christianity and so get a lot of their arguments from these. These books often quote the bible, not the koran - so muslims are forced to use the bible in their arguments.but they don’t understand the bible, nor the arguments being presented - that’s a flaw that can be exploited by folks who want to demolish their argument.
Excellent post, PorkScratchings! Muslims are kept so busy trying to refute everyone else’s faith, that they have no time to look critically at their own!
I’m a muslim and I dont quote our scripture to a non-muslim to try and prove that Jesus is not God
There are many christians that do the opposite, that is, using the bible to prove to non christians that Jesus is God.
Similarly, how can the christians expect to prove something from corrupted texts?
One question for you, on your #1.
By what means can or do you try and prove Jesus is not God?
Just curious since you brought up your methods.