Why Do Muslims Have Problems With Paul?


#1

This thread is a follow up from the thread **Questions for Muslims ** where Paul has been discussed. To Christians, Paul was one of its greatest sons, an outstanding saint and a great servant of God. Yet we hear quite the opposite from Muslims. Among all Christian figures, Paul is perhaps the most hated by them.

I am curious about their attitude towards Paul and hope more discussion here will shed clearer light on this subject.


#2

Jesus (pbuh) was a very devout Jew. No Jew could ever raise a finger at him and say why do you not observe the Sabbath? Why do you eat pork? Indeed, it is the apostles of Jesus and not Jesus himself who are depicted in the NT as violating the law. The Bible tells us that Jesus (pbuh) departed never having eaten pork, never having violated the Sabbath, divorce was disallowed except in adultery during his lifetime, he followed the law of Moses to the letter. However, Paul’s dreams have now legalized for all Christians that which Jesus (according to the Bible) died believing in.

You will not find a single priest or evangelist who tells his Christian followers “to enter heaven, only keep the commandments” (as his “Lord” did). The vast majority of Christians today do not refrain from eating pork nor do they observe the Sabbath as their “Lord” did, and died doing. There are so many differences between Christians today and Jesus and his actions. Christians in general follow the commandments of Paul and others who are given the power to totally cancel out all of the commandments of both Moses and Jesus, and no Christian has any reservations whatsoever. Christianity is literally built around the premise that disciples of disciples, have the power to cancel the commandments of their prophets and even the law practiced by the alleged Son of God himself.

Let us look at this matter a little closer. God commanded the Jews to observe a very disciplined dietary regimen. This is where the Jews get the word “Kosher” from. “Kosher” refers to all food that it is permissible for a Jew to eat. Among those food that God forbade upon all Jews was swine. For this reason we find that Jesus (pbuh) considered pigs such filthy and disgusting animals that not only did he never taste their flesh (incidentally, Muslims also live out their lives never having tasted a single swine), but he literally considered them so lowly that they were only fit as garbage dumps for devils. In Matthew 8:31-32 we read
"So the devils besought him, saying, If thou cast us out, suffer us to go away into the herd of swine And he said unto them, Go. And when they were come out, they went into the herd of swine: and, behold, the whole herd of swine ran violently down a steep place into the sea, and perished in the waters…"
However, shortly after Jesus’ departure, Paul makes lawful all of the creatures of the earth, "If any of them that believe not bid you [to a feast], and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake."
1 Corinthians 10:27

In one tragic moment, Jesus’ lifetime of restraint was casually swept under the carpet. Many people believe that the vision of Peter found in Acts was the primary factor in the cancellation of this fundamental law of the Jews. However, Christian scholars today are well aware that the writings of Paul are the oldest writings to be found in the Bible. They were written between 50-60 AD while even the four Gospels themselves were written decades later between 70-110 C.E. Secondly, the book of Acts (70-90 AD) although popularly considered to have been written by Paul, is now recognized to have been written by some unknown author(s) other than Paul but who was/were sympathetic to his cause.
According to the Bible, Jesus (pbuh) spent his whole life in strict adherence to the commandments of the law of Moses (pbuh). He departed leaving his followers with the following words:
“Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, TILL HEAVEN AND EARTH PASS, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” Matthew 5:17-19

Paul’s dreams, however, have broken commandments right and left. There is so much of what Jesus (pbuh) did during his lifetime that his followers have now totally neglected, not because Jesus (pbuh) told them to break the commandments, but because Paul would later tell them to break them upon the authority of the visions he was receiving.


#3

So, what we have concluded from the current view of Jesus’ master plan is the following:

  1. Jesus (pbuh) lived among his people for thirty three years showing them many miracles and teaching them to keep the commandments of Moses, to observe the Sabbath, to refrain from eating pork, to circumcise their children, to fast with the Jews, to worship in the synagogues, and so forth. He did not do this with his words alone but gave them an example in his own actions. Whenever he spoke about his miracles he claimed that he did them through “the finger of God” and that he “can of mine own self do nothing.” Whenever he spoke of worship he would say “worship the Father” and not “worship me,” “worship the Trinity,” or “worship us.” He also never said “I am a god.” The term “son of God” was used by his people for many millennia before him to describe a devout servant of God and applied in the Bible to many prophets before him and even to common people. Further, God was understood by the people of his time to be the “Father” of all those who love him.

  2. For three centuries after the departure of Jesus (pbuh), his apostles and their followers (excluding Paul and his followers) continued the tradition of Jesus (pbuh) as faithful Jews and followers of the law of Moses (pbuh). They practiced their worship in the synagogues of the Jews, they visited the Temple daily, and for all intents and purposes were indistinguishable from all other Jews except for the fact that they affirmed that Jesus (pbuh) was the promised Messiah, which many Jews did not (and still do not) accept. None of these people, not even Paul, had ever heard of a “Trinity.” Jesus (pbuh) decided not to reveal his (and God’s) “true” nature until three centuries after his departure. He decided that three centuries after his departure it would be time to come to the church and give them divine “inspiration” to “insert” verses in the Bible validating the “Trinity” (such as 1 John 5:7). These “inspired” revelations from Jesus are documented by Christian historians to have been continuing at least up till the fifteenth century CE (see above). Jesus also “inspired” them to utterly destroy all Gospels written before this fourth century which did not teach this “true” nature of Jesus as being God. He further “inspired” the church to utterly destroy all ancient manuscripts written in the original Aramaic or Hebrew language of Jesus (pbuh) and the apostles. He “inspired” them that the Greek and Latin manuscripts would be amply sufficient. And finally, he “inspired” them to launch a massive campaign of “inquiry” to “cleanse” the earth of all remaining Unitarian Christians or convert them.

  3. When Jesus (pbuh) departed, his followers continued to faithfully follow his example and observe the laws of Moses. Now Paul comes along and persecutes the followers of Jesus every way he knows how. He admits that:
    “For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews’ religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it” Galatians 1:13 (also see Acts 7:58-60, 8:1-3)

Now Jesus (pbuh) decides to bypass his apostles and go directly to the worst persecutor of his followers on earth in a “vision” and give him knowledge not available to the apostles. Paul now reveals that God holds all of mankind responsible for the sin of Adam (Romans 5:11-19, 1 Corinthians 15:22). God himself, however, claims long before Paul was ever born that “The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin” (Deuteronomy 24:16) and “The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son” (Ezekiel 18:20)…etc.


#4
  1. Paul further revealed that Jesus came to him in visions and told him to nullify the commandments of God which he had spent thirty three years on earth upholding and teaching his followers to observe, and that these commandments “decayeth,” were ready to “vanish away,” and were a “curse” upon us. The only requirement in order to receive true salvation, according to Paul, is to believe in the original sin and the atonement. No actual work is necessary. This one belief is the only necessary and sufficient condition. However, Jesus departed not only never having violated the law of Moses but also having told his people that “till heaven and earth pass” whoever would dare to do so would be called “the least in the kingdom of God.” Jesus (pbuh) was claimed to have been conditioned and prepared for “the atonement” from the beginning of time, however, whenever he was asked about the path to heaven he not only never mentioned any atonement but only (repeatedly) told his followers to “keep the commandments.” Even when pressed for the path to perfection he only told his followers to sell their belongings.

  2. Jesus never in his life saw fit to write a single inspired word. However, after he died, he started appearing to countless people in their dreams and visions and commanding them to write in his name and guiding their words. He did not see fit to guide their hands from writing conflicting versions of the same story (chapter two) since these contradictions were intended to strengthen a Christian’s faith.

  3. Since the only course to salvation is to accept the sacrifice of Jesus (pbuh) and the law of Moses is worthless, therefore, God did not see fit to allow those born before Jesus (pbuh) including countless previous prophets to enter heaven, but rather allowed them to remain stained with the sin of Adam and gave them a very strict and disciplined law that was totally useless and could never relieve them of this hereditary stain. These people shall never receive true salvation. Only those after Jesus (pbuh) will receive true salvation (Romans 3:28…etc.).

And here’s some links for additional Muslim Perspectives (although some are from Christian sites):

Who was the founder of Christianity? Jesus or Paul?
Christianity’s true founder, Paul, admits fabrication
The Apostle Paul Founder of Christianity


#5

Jesus himself regularly broke the Jewish laws - how? by touching lepers when he healed them. These were unclean people according to Jewish law, certainly not to be touched. Yet Jesus frequently did so, as he did with all the people he healed.

In addition, as is correctly stated, Jesus’ own followers break the law, in one instance by eating with unwashed hands, but there are others as well. The fact is he not only permits their doing so but approves - he speaks APPROVINGLY of a time when King David committed the sacrilege of eating the special bread which was reserved by the priests.

Finally there is Jesus’ saying ‘there is nothing that GOES INTO a man’s mouth that makes him unclean, but only what comes out of it.’ Very clearly these words of his mean that observation of the million and one dietary rules the Jews had is no longer necessary or relevant to salvation - only the behaviour of the person before God. And notice he said ‘keep MY commands’, not ‘keep the Jews’ commands’. Jesus’ commands were summarised in two - love of God and love of neighbour, not obedience to Jewish dietary rules.

Then, as any Christian can tell you, it was not Paul who did away with Jewish dietary rules, it was Peter, Jesus’ own endorsed leader of his Church after his death, following a dream in which God himself commands Peter to eat of animals that are ritually unclean.


#6

[quote=LilyM]

Then, as any Christian can tell you, it was not Paul who did away with Jewish dietary rules, it was Peter, Jesus’ own endorsed leader of his Church after his death, following a dream in which God himself commands Peter to eat of animals that are ritually unclean.

hehe correct…maybe we should call it now : Peteren Christianity? :wink: oh no, since Paul and Peter preached together, it should be “PaulPeterene” Christianity :smiley:
[/quote]


#7

before we start explaining about it, lets look at what the quran says:

Behold! Allah said: “O Jesus! I will take thee and raise thee to Myself and clear thee (of the falsehoods) of those who blaspheme; I will make those who follow thee SUPERIOR to those who reject faith, TO THE DAY OF RESURRECTION: Then shall ye all return unto Me, and I will judge between you of the matters wherein ye dispute.” S. 3:55

O ye who believe! Be ye helpers of Allah: as said Jesus the son of Mary to the Disciples, “Who will be my helpers to (the work of) Allah?” Said the Disciples, “We are Allah’s helpers!” then a portion of the Children of Israel believed, and a portion disbelieved: But We gave power to those who believed against their enemies, AND THEY BECAME THE ONES THAT PREVAILED. S. 61:14

What do we read? allah granted Jesus’ followers the power to prevail over the disbelievers &made them superior till the day of resurection… yet the ones that prevailed were apostles such as Paul his followers…this means that if the quran is correct, then Paul’s message is the truth since it has dominated and prevailed over all other opposing messages.

:dancing:


#8

Who really changed God’s revelation? Paul who actually saw Jesus? Or Muhammed (cpuh) who rewrote everything? I think Paul is closer to the source and far more appealing. He never killed anyone or married a 9 year old.


#9

[quote=inJESUS]allah granted Jesus’ followers the power to prevail over the disbelievers &made them superior till the day of resurection… yet the ones that prevailed were apostles such as Paul his followers…this means that if the quran is correct, then Paul’s message is the truth since it has dominated and prevailed over all other opposing messages.

:dancing:
[/quote]

:dancing: nice to see the Quran put to such good use!


#10

[quote=jcaz]Jesus (pbuh) was a very devout Jew. No Jew could ever raise a finger at him and say why do you not observe the Sabbath?

you bet they did…the Bible says so and Jesus replied : i am the Lord of the sabbath.

never having violated the Sabbath,

mmm

divorce was disallowed except in adultery during his lifetime,

but NOT during Moses’ time…

he followed the law of Moses to the letter.

not really…Moses told you BUT I TELL YOU…Jesus reinterpreted Moses’ law, linking it to our hearts, since the new covenant God talked about is a spiritual one :

“Look, the days are coming, Yahweh declares, when I shall make a new covenant with the House of Israel (and the House of Judah), but not like the covenant I made with their ancestors the day I brought them…out of Egypt…No, this is the covenant I shall make with the House of Israel when those days have come, Yahweh declares. Within them I shall plant my Law, writing it on their hearts.”

thats why Jesus reinterpreted the old law, linking it to the heart…hence you see Jesus’ emphasis on the HEART, unlike the “physical” old law :

Unlike the temporary covenant made at Sinai, the “New Covenant” would be “everlasting.” While the Old Covenant was a physical covenant (with physical circumcision as its sign), the New Covenant would be a spiritual covenant (with circumcision of the “heart” being its sign-Romans 2:28-29). This was foreshadowed in Deuteronomy 10:16 wherein God spoke of the “circumcision of the foreskin of the heart” as proof of a real attitude change. When the Old Covenant was replaced by the New Covenant, the sign of the Old Covenant (circumcision) became moot and unnecessary.

If you read any of Jesus’ “but i tell you”, you’ll realize they all are linked to spirituality, to the heart.

However, Paul’s dreams have now legalized for all Christians that which Jesus (according to the Bible) died believing in.

it was Peter’s dream not Paul’s. And this is from neither Peter nor Paul, but Mathew:

What goes into the mouth does not make anyone unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes someone unclean."

Christians in general follow the commandments of Paul and others who are given the power to totally cancel out all of the commandments of both Moses and Jesus, and no Christian has any reservations whatsoever.

if you believe the Bible is correct, then muslims do the opposite of Jesus’ teachings and even the opposite of Moses’…Camel as well is prohibited by the Old law, but in islam it is permitted.

Christianity is literally built around the premise that disciples of disciples, have the power to cancel the commandments of their prophets and even the law practiced by the alleged Son of God himself.

neither did. It was Jesus himself who said : i am the Lord of the sabbath…and since He himself said that not what enters the mouth defiles it, then He meant what He said coz He is the Lord of the Law.

According to the Bible, Jesus (pbuh) spent his whole life in strict adherence to the commandments of the law of Moses (pbuh).

nop. Why didnt Jesus stone the adulterous as per Moses’ law?

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, TILL HEAVEN AND EARTH PASS, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled

often misunderstood…to fulfill does not mean to condone everything otherwise Jesus wouldnt have reinterpreted the law. And nothing will be changed until He comes back again.

Paul’s dreams, however, have broken commandments right and left. There is so much of what Jesus (pbuh) did during his lifetime that his followers have now totally neglected, not because Jesus (pbuh) told them to break the commandments, but because Paul would later tell them to break them upon the authority of the visions he was receiving

wrong…Paul did neither and Paul himself applied the law…but what he said is that it is not the law that saves, but Jesus Christ…It is the New covenant we follow , not the old, just like God in the OT says…the New Covenat, the Spiritual covenant of the heart, not the body…
[/quote]


#11

[quote=LilyM]:dancing: nice to see the Quran put to such good use!
[/quote]

hehe well i guess there is no need to even explain Paul cuz according to quran his teachings are truth …but well, we should at least try to explain that what Paul did was what Jesus wanted.


#12

oh my, the more i read Jcaz posts, the more i realize how much he misunderstood Paul’s words. No wonder Peter said about Paul:

And consider the patience of our Lord as salvation, as our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, also wrote to you,
16
speaking of these things 12 as he does in all his letters. In them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.

gtg now…i’ll continue tomorrow God willing. God bless all

In Christ


#13

Dear Christians, before i go, i’d like to ask you the favour of correcting any of my posts whenever needed…am no scholar…but about to start studying theology in a theology school :smiley:


#14

jcaz,

In the future, please try to keep your response length somewhat below that of a short novel.

Thanks and God bless.


#15

[quote=LilyM]Jesus himself regularly broke the Jewish laws - how? by touching lepers when he healed them. These were unclean people according to Jewish law, certainly not to be touched. Yet Jesus frequently did so, as he did with all the people he healed.

In addition, …
[/quote]

Dear LilyM,

Let me correct your false premise here before you build a structure upon it in vain.

Your above claim is based on an assumption that whatever is in your New Testament is true and inspired word of God/Holy Spirit.

This assumption is false because not each and every word of New Testament is true for various reasons. The text of the NT is altered. So, your **Catholic Encycolpedia ** informs you about the text of the New Testament, under a sub-title: **IV. TRANSMISSION OF THE TEXT [of the New Testament]: **

[INDENT]
No book of ancient times has come down to us exactly as it left the hands of its author–all have been in some way altered.

The material conditions under which a book was spread before the invention of printing (1440), the little care of the copyists, correctors, and glossators for the text, so different from the desire of accuracy exhibited to-day, explain sufficiently the divergences we find between various manuscripts of the same work.

To these causes may be added, in regard to the Scriptures, exegetical difficulties and dogmatical controversies. To exempt the scared writings from ordinary conditions a very special providence would have been necessary, and it has not been the will of God to exercise this providence. More than 150,000 different readings have been found in the older witnesses to the text of the New Testament–which in itself **is a proof ** that Scriptures are not the only, nor the principal, means of revelation.
newadvent.org/cathen/14530a.htm#IV ]

Did you notice how the alteration and unreliability of the text of the **New Testament ** is conveniently “justified” by saying “that Scriptures are not the only, nor the principal, means of revelation”?

Your Church/Bible Scholars had to come up with some “solution” to the unauthenticity of the NT. Now you are basically at the mercy of Church’s traditions because your Bible does not contain full deposits of your faith.

And by now do you know how many Churches, denominations, cults and sects are in the whole “Christiandom”? They are in thousands. Each and everyone of these claim to have same Holy Spirit/Ghost and under whose guidance/inspiration they all interpret/understand their version of the Bible and as such it is natural that they all differ each other, blaspheme each other and send their opponents to the Hell-fire if they disagree with their own concocted view/interpreation/understanding. I wonder how same Holy Spirit/Ghost is inspiring different things to all these Churches that none of them is ever ready to give up or merge his Church/sect/cult/denomination with the other.

Then, all the reported words of Jesus and about Jesus are not necessarily true rendition of Jesus’ thoughts/words/actions because all the authors of 4 so called Canonical Gospels are not the actual disciples of Jesus nor their identity is descisively recognised. These gospels are written out of discontinued oral tradition and heresay. They are not even like news reports of our day which usually contain errors/mistakes and deliberate distortions and no two reports can be the same.

Now if you take Jesus’ saying that *he came to restore and fulfill the Law and the Prophets * and *not to destroy * then there is no room to believe that Jesus or his true followers broke the Law. You have to pick one out of these two, either:

  1. Jesus followed the law by not chopping anything from it but might have add something as an extension without changing the whole rationale of the Law and the Prophets.

OR

  1. He did broke the Law. .

In the first case a major part of Jesus mission and a major part of Old Testament makes sense and all appear to be on the same page.

In the seond option, Jesus appeared as a liar and all the efforts of previous Prophets of God, the Law become meaningless.

For an unbias independent intellectual person:

  • The first option makes lot of sense and in it there is no harm for anyone and…

  • The second option makes no sense and in order to justify this option you have to concoct new foreign ideas and inject into the theology of Jesus and this is what exactly Paul did and his followers did and do. Thats why it is Paul who is considered as the actual founder of prevailing Christianity and not Jesus.[/INDENT]


#16

[quote=freedomm]Dear LilyM,

Let me correct your false premise here before you build a structure upon it in vain.

Your above claim is based on an assumption that whatever is in your New Testament is true and inspired word of God/Holy Spirit.

This assumption is false because not each and every word of New Testament is true for various reasons. The text of the NT is altered. So, your **Catholic Encycolpedia ** informs you about the text of the New Testament, under a sub-title: **IV. TRANSMISSION OF THE TEXT **[of the New Testament]:

[INDENT]
No book of ancient times has come down to us exactly as it left the hands of its author–all have been in some way altered.

The material conditions under which a book was spread before the invention of printing (1440), the little care of the copyists, correctors, and glossators for the text, so different from the desire of accuracy exhibited to-day, explain sufficiently the divergences we find between various manuscripts of the same work.

To these causes may be added, in regard to the Scriptures, exegetical difficulties and dogmatical controversies. To exempt the scared writings from ordinary conditions a very special providence would have been necessary, and it has not been the will of God to exercise this providence. More than 150,000 different readings have been found in the older witnesses to the text of the New Testament–which in itself **is a proof ** that Scriptures are not the only, nor the principal, means of revelation.
newadvent.org/cathen/14530a.htm#IV ]

Did you notice how the alteration and unreliability of the text of the **New Testament ** is conveniently “justified” by saying “that Scriptures are not the only, nor the principal, means of revelation”?

Your Church/Bible Scholars had to come up with some “solution” to the unauthenticity of the NT. Now you are basically at the mercy of Church’s traditions because your Bible does not contain full deposits of your faith.

And by now do you know how many Churches, denominations, cults and sects are in the whole “Christiandom”? They are in thousands. Each and everyone of these claim to have same Holy Spirit/Ghost and under whose guidance/inspiration they all interpret/understand their version of the Bible and as such it is natural that they all differ each other, blaspheme each other and send their opponents to the Hell-fire if they disagree with their own concocted view/interpreation/understanding. I wonder how same Holy Spirit/Ghost is inspiring different things to all these Churches that none of them is ever ready to give up or merge his Church/sect/cult/denomination with the other.

Then, all the reported words of Jesus and about Jesus are not necessarily true rendition of Jesus’ thoughts/words/actions because all the authors of 4 so called Canonical Gospels are not the actual disciples of Jesus nor their identity is descisively recognised. These gospels are written out of discontinued oral tradition and heresay. They are not even like news reports of our day which usually contain errors/mistakes and deliberate distortions and no two reports can be the same.

Now if you take Jesus’ saying that *he came to restore and fulfill the Law and the Prophets * and *not to destroy * then there is no room to believe that Jesus or his true followers broke the Law. You have to pick one out of these two, either:

  1. Jesus followed the law by not chopping anything from it but might have add something as an extension without changing the whole rationale of the Law and the Prophets.

OR

  1. He did broke the Law. .

In the first case a major part of Jesus mission and a major part of Old Testament makes sense and all appear to be on the same page.

In the seond option, Jesus appeared as a liar and all the efforts of previous Prophets of God, the Law become meaningless.

For an unbias independent intellectual person:

  • The first option makes lot of sense and in it there is no harm for anyone and…

  • The second option makes no sense and in order to justify this option you have to concoct new foreign ideas and inject into the theology of Jesus and this is what exactly Paul did and his followers did and do. Thats why it is Paul who is considered as the actual founder of prevailing Christianity and not Jesus.[/INDENT]
    [/quote]

:whistle: :whistle:


#17

[quote=inJESUS]Dear Christians, before i go, i’d like to ask you the favour of correcting any of my posts whenever needed…am no scholar…but about to start studying theology in a theology school :smiley:
[/quote]

Good luck with your study!. Lucky you have time. I dont have much time left to study theology :frowning:

answer-islam.org/Stpaulandislam.html


#18

[quote=Cyber Knight]Good luck with your study!. Lucky you have time. I dont have much time left to study theology :frowning:

answer-islam.org/Stpaulandislam.html
[/quote]

hehe i WILL find time…there are classes at night…but i think i’ll have to wait for the beginning of next year :mad: hehe


#19

Hey freedom, again with Paul? what does your quran say ? :smiley: Regarding your meaningless responses, no one will respond because you do not deserve one since you obviously you DO NOT want to understand after this time what the Bible is. Shall i repeat my questions to match your level? who wrote the quran? humans. \how do you make sure they did not err? you cannot. How do you make sure the quran you have is one of the ones Uthman burnt? you can’t…why are there lost verses according to hadith? what about vovels and marks added LATER ? and what about ayas with a dozen different reading with the admission of muslim scholars? ok enough…either get to the level of a rational conversation or many won’t even read your posts…and everytime you put the same things, i ‘ll put the same questions regarding quran till you learn what the Bible is about …furthermore the quran says Jesus;’ message is presereved, God doesnt change his word.,.ecc…lets’ stick to doctrines instead of all this baseless blaim…


#20

[quote=inJESUS]Regarding your meaningless responses, no one will respond because you do not deserve one since you obviously you DO NOT want to understand after this time what the Bible is.
[/quote]

:amen: :whistle: :whistle:


DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.