Why My Defenses of Catholicism are sometimes VERY (unintentionally) Offensive and overly Emphatic:


#1

Hi dear people. Below I explain WHY I am so emphatic in many of my posts, even to the point of (unintentionally) offending people.
I do so, because from my background, being brainwashed as both an antiCatholic and anti-ALL Trinitarian Christians, because I have to for my protection and, please God, to help others,whom I know are in error and are letting national pride, church pride, love of family, and other things, block their ability to see the historical truth about ACTUAL apostolic Christianity, which is, truly, absolutely, Catholic. Thanks all.

The Edwardian Ordinal was implemented explicitly to reject the SACERDOTAL nature of the ordained episcopate and priesthood. As for those who later disagreed with these denials, even so,you CANNOT pass on (by ordaining) to others what YOU YOURSELF DO NOT HAVE:
All my belief in the world in the sacerdotal nature of the episcopate and priesthood,
and I do believe it all, does not, not, not give me the ability thus to pass it on because, even though I do believe it, I myself, have not been validly ordained. I cannot pass on what I do not as yet personally possess, it’s that simple.

As for Rome’s claim to authority being subjective and circular reasoning, or,
as one poster put it,
ROME HAS AUTHORITY BECAUSE ROME CLAIMS (to have) AUTHORITY,
that is error.
Rome has authority OBJECTIVELY speaking, and not based on subjective views.
This is easily verifiable by research into what the earliest, apostolically taught christians, believed about the church, the authority of the episcopate, the authority of Peter WITHIN that episcopate, and the place of Rome as the place from which PETER’s authority flowed, and this even AFTER Peter had died.

Please, folks, please understand where I am “coming from” in all this:
This stuff is not some prideful matter of argumentation for me.
I don’t enjoy debating it, nor do I do so in order to “beat somebody” in an argument.
PLEASE UNDERSTAND, I have no pride in this matter.
PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS :
I was raised in a ferociously antiCatholic CULT, and from tiny childhood imbibed ALL the extremely destructive (mentally, socially, psychologically, religiously and yes, even job and income-wise) beliefs of this cult religion which, like all non Catholic groups, claimed to be the Original Christian faith.
This is NOT, NOT, NOT some “academic” exercise for me.
To find out that I had “BEEN HAD,” and to heal after all that brainwashing,
I had to go back and DIG, DIG, DIG into what the REAL Original Faith actually was. This was and is NO mere prideful intellectual exercise for me, nor a matter of I’m right, your wrong, nyah nyah nyah nyah nyaaaaaah nyaah!!!
It is, mentally and spiritually, and for my sanity’s sake, a matter of Life and Death.
Literally.
And when I find out, for sure, as I have, what the Original was,
I cannot STAND IT, deep inside, when I see people, good people, being deceived by falsehoods about true, apostolic Christianity. I care not one whit for national pride,
“traditional” beliefs against the papacy, whether by protestants or by the orthodox, none of those things matter to me. I am not interested in flattering people. I hate seeing people being deceived, good people, about such vital and holy matters.
Even if momma and daddy, whom you adore, passed your faith on to you. If it is mistaken, it is still mistaken (on some points) even if momma and daddy are now high ranking saints in heaven.
Pride should play NO ROLE in these discussions, nor should SUBJECTIVE beliefs, nor stubborn-ness.
I was brainwashed by a cult that exists today PRECISELY BECAUSE of two main things:
(1) a schism occured in 1054 A.D. that was “gotten away with” and because
(2) a massive rebellion, based largely on lies and private interpretations with no authority
…at all except the prideful assertions of personal accuracy by the ones
…doing the rebelling, occured in the 16th century and was "gotten away with."
I know that that will offend many people, but it is the truth.
If THAT had not happened, and been “gotten away with,” there would BE NO
vast volumes of antiCatholic propaganda (which these rebels originated) for later cult-founders to use (and believe me, they use that false propaganda to the HILT).
If (1) and (2) had not happened and not been “gotten away with,” it is pure fact that
me, and millions of others, would NOT have had our minds wrecked, our psyches violated, our spirituality DESTROYED for DECADES, and the cults whosse teachings destroyed us, such as Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormons, extreme anti-Catholic fundies, and others, WOULD NOT EXIST TODAY.
That, dear people, Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant,
is why I am very emphatic, even to sometimes offensive, in my posts.
They are not meant to offend. But I am direct. I cannot afford, after all the lasting harm done to me (and millions like me, many of whom are still trapped in those cults and are also nice, well-meaning people) to be less than firm and emphatic. I have done my homework about what IS the true faith. I have done it. I have no agenda other than to survive. I make no money from my views or from spreading them. They aren’t my mere “views,” either.
I have to be firm. After 30 years of hell and permanent damage that continues to this day,
I will not back down when I know a certain position is erroneous. I dare not do so.
God love all of you, and may he richly bless you in this life and the next.
Love,
Jaypeeto4


#2

Hey Jaypeeto4,

Keep on being you.

:blessyou:


#3

[quote="Jaypeeto4, post:1, topic:280927"]

PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS :
I was raised in a ferociously antiCatholic CULT, and from tiny childhood imbibed ALL the extremely destructive (mentally, socially, psychologically, religiously and yes, even job and income-wise) beliefs of this cult religion which, like all non Catholic groups, claimed to be the Original Christian faith.
This is NOT, NOT, NOT some "academic" exercise for me.
To find out that I had "BEEN HAD," and to heal after all that brainwashing,
I had to go back and DIG, DIG, DIG into what the REAL Original Faith actually was. This was and is NO mere prideful intellectual exercise for me, nor a matter of I'm right, your wrong, nyah nyah nyah nyah nyaaaaaah nyaah!!!
It is, mentally and spiritually, and for my sanity's sake, a matter of Life and Death.
Literally.
And when I find out, for sure, as I have, what the Original was,
I cannot STAND IT, deep inside, when I see people, good people, being deceived by falsehoods about true, apostolic Christianity.

[/quote]

:hug1: Hugs for you. I read a lot of hurt there.


#4

I think it’s scary and sad how people use the unelected popular media as the litmus test against which to gauge how to live one’s life and what to believe. The more extremist the unelected popular culture gets, the more extreme the church appears relatively speaking, even if it’s not true. If only more people would think about it.


#5

Thank you, all above,
for all your kind and quiet insightful comments.
God bless you,
Jaypeeto4


#6

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek”(Rom.1:16)

You have every right to defend your beliefs. I came out of a cult myself. The feeling of being played for a sucker makes you feel like an ***. It did me. If you know that what you have is God’s truth, then you have to defend it. Keep fighting the good fight, brother. God will bless you for your efforts.


#7

Which one?


#8

[quote="Jaypeeto4, post:1, topic:280927"]
I have to be firm. After 30 years of hell and permanent damage that continues to this day,I will not back down when I know a certain position is erroneous. I dare not do so.God love all of you, and may he richly bless you in this life and the next.
Love,
Jaypeeto4

[/quote]

I am sorry of what you had to go through in your spiritual journey but look at now...you are a warrior for the truth.:thumbsup:


#9

[quote="Jaypeeto4, post:5, topic:280927"]
Thank you, all above,
for all your kind and quiet insightful comments.
God bless you,
Jaypeeto4

[/quote]

May I offer you caution, my friend? As a Catholic, first you must understand LOVE! of everyone and everything in the universe created by God. From that love MUST stem the humility and compassion to discuss or debate with ALL who do not yet have it!

God brought you home, in spite what you may think! HE will do the same for all in His own time. You, like us, are His avenues for information and instruments of His glory in how we conduct ourselves everyday of our lives.

No Pope has EVER 'argued' the truth with those unwilling to hear, yet they possess all and more of what a Catholic must know! They simply answer and state the truth as we are given. Sure, we can elaborate and debate for clarification.

Arguing in the public square is relatively NEW to Catholics with the advent of communication mediums and technology! This is a phenomena which has become vociferous since Protestants discovered the truth about The Church, just as when 'they' first splintered off, hurling abuse at Her. But remember, it is the Church of the entire UNIVERSE and everyone 'belong' to Her whether they know it or not!

I remember as a child that our household used to have U.S Mormon missionaries stay with us all the time and all kinds of missionaries from abroad, yet our family are cradle Catholics and remain Catholics. God is God and first and foremost is His Love to be shown and He does what He does as He Wills.

Be a light unto the world...first! and be prepared to answer those who enquire about the faith within you, by educating yourself and HARNESSING what you already knew and brought with you! There is a reason you came through the path that you did!

I used to get livid inside when I heard people erroneously dissing The Church, and still do, but I knew that we weren't supposed to argue with people unless they asked! This forum and many like it is such a place where discussion and debate can occur when people enquire about Catholicism.

All that said, I love your verve for Our Lord and His Church and don't be put off what you're doing! Just remember, Love first, before you 'punch' them in the intellectual cortex!! ha ha..

:cool:


#10

An emphatic defense of Catholicism has never been more needed. More power to you, my good sir. Some of us are better at defending the Faith than others, and we need those that have the gift.


#11

I agree that we should love those in error.

We are all in error to some degree, because in a complex world with many variables,
some "error" is impossible to avoid.

But some religions are much more seriously HARMFUL to their members than others.
And it is not love, at all, to let people remain, deceived, by these religions which produce in them
(1) absolute HATRED and LOATHING of historic Christianity
(2) DEEP, life-wrecking PARANOIA that EVERYBODY is out to get THEM,
.....and get THEM in PARTICULAR.
(3) A fierce and sinful PRIDE that they, the 0.001% of humanity who have the truth,
.....have it because, rather than an unearned grace, God "saw" that THEY had
....."righteous" hearts whereas 99.999% of humanity are "willfully wicked",
.....except the tiny number (by comparison) who will eventually join their cult.
(4) a fear and terror of even lovely and reverent songs such as SILENT NIGHT
.....and O LITTLE TOWN OF BETHLEHEM, having had it drummed into their heads,
....quote, that "Satan is responsible for those pretty songs which he inspires to
....keep people doomed in the clutches of (trinitarian) Apostate Christendom (meaning
....all, all Christians outside their relatively teeny-weeny cult and
(5) a belief that it is actually a VIRTUE to NOT contribute ANYTHING to charity
....or to food banks or homeless shelters because "God is gonna destroy it all
....REALLY REALLY soon anyway, so why try to save a sinking ship??
....This is how they tell their members NOT TO help their less fortunate brothers and
....sisters: because they aren't cult members and God is going to kill them for this
....any day now anyway, so why open soup kitchens and shelters for doomed people??

Allowing people to remain enslaved, in groups like THIS, is NOT "LOVE."
The Mormons are heretical on many points (sorry, dear Mormon guests), but one thing I will say FOR them: they do NOT teach such callousness and out and out hate and paranoia. They operate many charities, for their OWN members AND for others.
OTHER non-trinitarian groups/cults, do NOT. And mine did not. And was PROUD of it.


#12

Trebor God Bless you on your spiritual journey East. Pray that God re-unite West & East…once and for all. :gopray2:


#13

[quote="Jaypeeto4, post:1, topic:280927"]
Hi dear people. Below I explain WHY I am so emphatic in many of my posts, even to the point of (unintentionally) offending people.
I do so, because from my background, being brainwashed as both an antiCatholic and anti-ALL Trinitarian Christians, because I have to for my protection and, please God, to help others,whom I know are in error and are letting national pride, church pride, love of family, and other things, block their ability to see the historical truth about ACTUAL apostolic Christianity, which is, truly, absolutely, Catholic. Thanks all.

The Edwardian Ordinal was implemented explicitly to reject the SACERDOTAL nature of the ordained episcopate and priesthood. As for those who later disagreed with these denials, even so,you CANNOT pass on (by ordaining) to others what YOU YOURSELF DO NOT HAVE:
All my belief in the world in the sacerdotal nature of the episcopate and priesthood,
and I do believe it all, does not, not, not give me the ability thus to pass it on because, even though I do believe it, I myself, have not been validly ordained. I cannot pass on what I do not as yet personally possess, it's that simple.

As for Rome's claim to authority being subjective and circular reasoning, or,
as one poster put it,
ROME HAS AUTHORITY BECAUSE ROME CLAIMS (to have) AUTHORITY,
that is error.
Rome has authority OBJECTIVELY speaking, and not based on subjective views.
This is easily verifiable by research into what the earliest, apostolically taught christians, believed about the church, the authority of the episcopate, the authority of Peter WITHIN that episcopate, and the place of Rome as the place from which PETER's authority flowed, and this even AFTER Peter had died.

Please, folks, please understand where I am "coming from" in all this:
This stuff is not some prideful matter of argumentation for me.
I don't enjoy debating it, nor do I do so in order to "beat somebody" in an argument.
PLEASE UNDERSTAND, I have no pride in this matter.
PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS :
I was raised in a ferociously antiCatholic CULT, and from tiny childhood imbibed ALL the extremely destructive (mentally, socially, psychologically, religiously and yes, even job and income-wise) beliefs of this cult religion which, like all non Catholic groups, claimed to be the Original Christian faith.
This is NOT, NOT, NOT some "academic" exercise for me.
To find out that I had "BEEN HAD," and to heal after all that brainwashing,
I had to go back and DIG, DIG, DIG into what the REAL Original Faith actually was. This was and is NO mere prideful intellectual exercise for me, nor a matter of I'm right, your wrong, nyah nyah nyah nyah nyaaaaaah nyaah!!!
It is, mentally and spiritually, and for my sanity's sake, a matter of Life and Death.
Literally.
And when I find out, for sure, as I have, what the Original was,
I cannot STAND IT, deep inside, when I see people, good people, being deceived by falsehoods about true, apostolic Christianity. I care not one whit for national pride,
"traditional" beliefs against the papacy, whether by protestants or by the orthodox, none of those things matter to me. I am not interested in flattering people. I *hate* seeing people being deceived, good people, about such vital and holy matters.
Even if momma and daddy, whom you adore, passed your faith on to you. If it is mistaken, it is still mistaken (on some points) even if momma and daddy are now high ranking saints in heaven.
Pride should play NO ROLE in these discussions, nor should SUBJECTIVE beliefs, nor stubborn-ness.
I was brainwashed by a cult that exists today PRECISELY BECAUSE of two main things:
(1) a schism occured in 1054 A.D. that was "gotten away with" and because
(2) a massive rebellion, based largely on lies and private interpretations with no authority
..... That, dear people, Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant,
is why I am very emphatic, even to sometimes offensive, in my posts.
They are not meant to offend. But I am direct. I cannot afford, after all the lasting harm done to me (and millions like me, many of whom are still trapped in those cults and are also nice, well-meaning people) to be less than firm and emphatic. I have done my homework about what IS the true faith. I have done it. I have no agenda other than to survive. I make no money from my views or from spreading them. They aren't my mere "views," either.
I have to be firm. After 30 years of hell and permanent damage that continues to this day,
I will not back down when I know a certain position is erroneous. I dare not do so.
God love all of you, and may he richly bless you in this life and the next.
Love,
Jaypeeto4

[/quote]

Peet,

I for a time believed that some of what you say is true. I agree with the inherent evil of things. I believe that the Schism was an evil. I believe that Protestant thought is evil. The people that come to believe and become hateful are hateful because they are hateful.

Here is what I have learned. A hateful person will use something other than religion to spew their hate. Recognize that there are people that use religion, politics, emotions, and whatever they find handy to spew thier hate.

Think of it this way.....while the inherent evil in the things that divide..do exist it is ultimately the people that embrace these things and impart their inherent self using that which they embrace to be who they really are.

I admit I never saw any of your postings that I can recall that were emphatic. I like emphatic. I have never seen your posts that are offensive. I suppose it matters as to what your intentions are. If you are not trying to be offensive and you are percieved as offensive then you just may want to ask why someone was offended if you were not trying to be offensive and then explain what you have explained here.

Sounds like you have travelled a journey that is unique.:)


#14

[quote="Nicea325, post:12, topic:280927"]
Trebor God Bless you on your spiritual journey East. Pray that God re-unite West & East...once and for all. :gopray2:

[/quote]

Thank you. :) I see my "Religion" box misled you into concluding I had taken a particular decision. I apologize for the confusion and have remedied the situation.

Let us pray, however, for the reunion of all Christians and the conversion of non-trinitarians and cult members (not necessarily the same thing).

God bless. Back to our regularly-scheduled programming...


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