[quote="manualman, post:5, topic:198369"]
Politics is by its very nature a shallow and frequently manipulated thing. It can be very tempting to fall for the approach of "Pelosi is for abortion, therefore she is Satan-spawn and I must oppose everything she is for."
This is not catholic thinking. As catholics, we form our consciences based on principles (most clearly outlined in the catechism, as noted above). Then based on that formation, we address specific issues. What Pelosi or Limbaugh thinks of the particular issue is irrelevant.
Abortion is really a fairly simple issue to figure out when separated from the emotion and rhetoric. A sperm and egg join to create a completely new organism. It is scientifically demonstrable that the new organism is not part of the mother's body (different DNA) though it is dependant on it. It is scientifically provable that the new organism has human DNA and since it IS a life form, the only reasonable conclusion is that it is a human being. (If you deny that, the burden is on YOU to say what it is. It's not a bacteria, not a protozoa, certainly not a monkey, etc) At that point, the principle is easy to reason: You can't kill a human being for convenience, or even to avoid substantial inconvenience or risk.
Immigration is the same thing after you remove the rhetoric and heat. Are there legitimate reasons to regulate the migration of peoples across national borders? Yes! Is the condition of the USA such that our culture, resources, infrastructure and economy is unable to support large numbers of new immigrants? No. Quite the opposite! We have so few children of our own that our economic growth is actually dependant on immigration, our undeveloped resources are VAST, our culture has long been one of a melting pot of peoples, our infrastructure is among the best on Earth and there are throngs of people that would like to come here.
Now, what are the legal opportunities for poor and unskilled people to immigrate? Virtually nil. Nada. Zip. Unless you have connections (family or employer), you ain't coming to the USA from Mexico legally. Won't happen. And that is utterly STUPID. These are great people willing to work hard and sacrifice for their children's future. They are exactly the kind of immigrant that has always yearned to come to America. Why have we stonewalled them? There really is no good reason. Every lame attempt at a justification for our current policy is just a repeat of the same lame Xenophobic, self-interested protectionism cited by the people that tried to prevent OUR great grandparents from coming here. (We've got enough of those dirty, stinkin' Pollack, Irish, Italian, etc...)
Nancy has a lot wrong with her and I'm not sure where precisely she stands on immigration. But it's a done deal that we have a horribly broken and unjust immigration system in the USA. The tired, poor, broken, yearning to be free need not apply today. Instead, we pretend there is a solid wall blocking them off. Democrats secretly love it because the injustice guarantees that the kids of illegals will be a solid block of D voters for life. Republicans secretly love it because it guarantees them the votes of rednecks and business owners who exploit the disposable labor it provides. Every political group gains something from the status quo. Except those who would like to legally come to America and contribute to the dream. They get the shaft.
Again, I don't yet know where she stands, but I DO hate the proposals I've heard from all sides in recent years. Guest worker programs are a horrible idea that just creates a perpetual underclass. Amnesty rewards those who came here illegally and effectively punishes those who didn't come out of obedience to the law. Walls won't work unless a fair system is established first and aren't really meant to (IMO they are just red meat tossed to a certain political base).
A catholic solution would look like this (IMO):
1. Vastly increase the number of legal immigrants allowed with no strings attached.
2. Offer a plea bargain program for those here illegally to turn themselves in, get parole with community service, a nominal fine and 5 years of probation in which any felony or criminal misdemeanor gets them deported with no third chance (this IS the second). Upon 10 year of clean record, eligible for citizenship and pardon. Note that this isn't amnesty, though Hannity would likely try to call it that. This has teeth and rewards those who obeyed the law even when it was arguably unfair over those who disregarded it.
3. Enforce the borders and deport further violators once a fair legal means has been established.
The order of the above is crucially important. 3 cannot be done fairly until 1 and 2 are completed.
[quote="manualman, post:10, topic:198369"]
But elts, that's human political thinking, not christian principled reasoning. I see no reason the Church couldn't offer support for reasonable immigration reform when the opportunity arises. She just ought to put in a few life jabs with each press release to avoid any confusion that support for the issue is support for the party.
You know Manualman, I have no idea what is in the Dems. Immigration package. I have no idea what would be considered a reasonable Immigration package by the Bishops. Do you? Not to put you on the spot, but I just have no idea. The idea of illegals registering to work with the promise of fulfilling certain obligations and then going to the back of the line has some resonence with me.-:confused: