Women Priests

I just finished listening to Chris Aubert on the Right Here Right Now network and one of the topics he brought up was about a woman in the midwest who has been “ordained” a priest. She understands that this is outside of the Catholic Church but she sees a need to minister to people just out of prison, homeless, etc.

Chris mentioned that John Paul II stated definitively that women could not become priests.

We have this issue in the Lutheran churches as well. LCMS and WELS do not have women pastors but some of the less strict synods do. In fact, the LCMC church I attend would allow a woman pastor and do have women in liturgical positions such as distributing communion and leading worship service.

My take is that those roles ought to be left to the men and that the more women become involved and take over those positions the less we see men stepping up to be involved. What are your takes on this?

I might express this differently than some. My take on it doesn’t matter. Scripture and the historic of the Church Catholic, including orthodox Lutheranism, indicate that the ordained priesthood is not an open vocation to women. There are various other vocations are. My daughter, for example is in one, as a teacher in a Lutheran parochial school. In that capacity, she is a significant member of her parish’s ministerial team.

The Church’s take on it is what matters here.

Jon

The woman would not need to pretend to become a priest in order to minister as you described. Women do not need to be ordained or belong to a religions order to minister to people as you described in your OP. She can’t give absolution and she can’t confect the Eucharist or give last rites.

My take is that men can be priests and women cannot. That’s about it.

But, I don’t know why it is made out to be a big deal when men aren’t holding such and such positions, but it never seems to be a big deal when women are excluded.

I mean, the issue of the priesthood aside, this narrative that men are being oppressed due to their maleness by a system which is 100% controlled by men is laugh out loud funny. Like the idea that whites have it terrible in the United States because, you know, affirmative action and for the first time ever in 300 years, there’s a half non-white U.S. president. :rolleyes:

Control is not the issue. The Church has no authority to ordain women. Power and control are radical feminist concepts. Overthrowing the patriarchy, including the Church, was job one since the 1970s.

Ed

According to the following article, 70% of US Catholics think that women should be allowed to be ordained as priests.
cruxnow.com/church/2015/01

It does not matter what % of the laity think about it. The Holy Church is of God. It is not a democracy.

Such polls cover self-identified Catholic, but many of these wouldn’t have been to church in years–and others wouldn’t find the Catholic faith important in their lives.

How do you know that many have not been to church in years?

This number I can find suspect. It relies on what particular “Catholics” are polled. Who are these Catholics? are they Catholic in name only? Are they breakaway Catholics? it all depends on the pool of Catholics the survey is administered to. It is like if I wanted to assert that it is good to own a gun, and then take the survey at a gun show. I am confident I can get the numbers I want to make it say what I want it to say. Just my thoughts.

My take is that according to Scripture women are not called to be a priest or a pastor. LC-MS Concordia Publishing House has very good book on the subject - “Women Pastors?”.

Men alone can atone for the “sin of adam” as priests.

Yeah, my brain misfires a lot these days. Perhaps I didn’t state it as clearly as I ought to. What I meant was that in the church I attend, I don’t see the men up distributing communion, leading the service for the pastor…those types of roles…as I see in the LCMS churches that I have belonged to and/or attended.

There are a great many roles that women can be involved in that greatly enhance the ministerial teams and your daughter is a prime example of that. There are women Bible Studies, LWML groups, other groups outside of the church as well.

Sorry if I didn’t make myself more clear. :blush:

Rita

What right do we have to do what has not been done in any age before us? Did the apostles ordain women? As far as we can see, no. Did Christ set women in authority over the church? As far as we can see, no. Did any of the church fathers ordain women? As far as we can see no.

We have seen where this movement leads, it leads to the episcopalian church which denies Christianity. It leads to a liberalism where essential Christianity is denied.

Ever been to mass on Christmas Eve or Easter and seen the “new” faces?

Pope John Paul II:

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_22051994_ordinatio-sacerdotalis_en.html

Ed

I agree, but in these days of Jacobin equality it is hard to convince many folks that this is true.

I think your view of politics is too simplistic. The people in charge can have lots of different motivations. And a minority can suppress a majority. In fact every institution, including democratic government, works on the principle that the few in power control the majority.

this to me is clearly a true statement-the Catholic Church has never claimed to be a democracy-that perhaps is its strength-even though the laity disagrees with a particular position such as female Priests or birth control the latiy does know the rules ( at least at some point in their maturation process) & if they don’t like the rules and absolutely can not live with some of them they have the option to leave-yet many do not

why do they not leave -this is unclear and likely complicated

My Church embraced female Priests and it has overall -just in my opinion -been an unmitigatged disaster-for reasons again which I do not totally understand-female Priests or Pastors leads to other issues of human sexuality entering the Church and resulting in all sorts of confusion related to same sex marriage-ordination of lesbians and gays and others-

I do not believe there is any biblical support for women not being ordained and I also do believe that the catholic but even more so the Orthodox will never never ordain women

My specific Church ahs a new female Priest who was very active in the Catholic Church-she says " I did not want to be a dissenting catholic when God called me to the Priesthood-thus I went to the episcopal Church."-good for her-whether it is good for the Church may be a different matter

There’s a lot of people that think if they feel really good about an idea, that “God has called them” to whatever that notion is. Lots of Catholics leave the church because they think God “called them” to end a bad marriage, and “God led them” to the new spouse.

cmodrmac #18
I do not believe there is any biblical support for women not being ordained and I also do believe that the catholic but even more so the Orthodox will never never ordain women

The fact that Jesus chose only twelve Apostles, all male, when His Mother so highly regarded as “Queen of Heaven” was not accorded that honour, speaks volumes as does the teaching of the Magisterium established by Him

It is strange that the reality that the New Testament was assembled, authorized and confirmed by Christ’s Church as the Word of God, and in which Christ’s Catholic Church is identified clearly as His Church – “You are Peter and on this rock I will build My Church.” (Mt 16:18) – is so denied that when His Church teaches infallibly that women cannot be ordained priests, that is blithely ignored as of no account…

My specific Church ahs a new female Priest who was very active in the Catholic Church-she says " I did not want to be a dissenting catholic when God called me to the Priesthood-thus I went to the episcopal Church."-good for her-whether it is good for the Church may be a different matter

As the Church is “unfailingly holy” (Vatican II) and the only one established by the Christ with the fullness of His Truth, it takes a peculiar myopia to regard ditching Her Truths for a personal ambition, especially as the priesthood can be conferred only when the ordination is valid.

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