Would Creationism exist, without Protestantism?


Genesis: 1 In the beginning God created heaven and earth.

Catechism 279: "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."116 Holy Scripture begins with these solemn words. The profession of faith takes them up when it confesses that God the Father almighty is “Creator of heaven and earth” ( Apostles’ Creed ), “of all that is, seen and unseen” ( Nicene Creed ). We shall speak first of the Creator, then of creation and finally of the fall into sin from which Jesus Christ, the Son of God, came to raise us up again.

I did support each of my claims. I used councils, dogmatic statements, and Sacred Scripture.

You have not supported your claims, and all you said is “everyone knows” and then gave your personal interpretation of the catechism, and specifically only one part that only covers genesis. However, I have not used genesis in my argument. I used the genealogies from the rest of the Bible. So if you want to say why God’s written would lie to us about the genealogy of Christ, and his claim to the throne of David and Kingdom of the Jews, and make God a liar, I’m all ears.

Because that’s what I’m hearing from you, that the Bible flat out lies about Christ’s genealogy.

But of course, you can’t come up with actual Catholic arguments against it because Catholicism has never Directly taught against those claims I made, or against young earth, because it can’t.

Also, I originally wasn’t YEC, I became so because of the Catholic Church’s teachings. Which means no, not all catechized Catholics believe that. In fact most I know believe YEC.

I find the whole discussion to be rather counterproductive. We are here, ultimately, no matter the specific processes that brought us here. Perhaps we got here 6000 years after the universe began, perhaps it was 12 billion or something.

My personal belief is that the theory of evolution is a more useful framework to describe the world around us regardless of its innate truth (or lack thereof).
The question, it seems to me, is not which explanation for the beginning of all things is true, but how are our actions affected by it? Meaning, which theory is of greater value in the here and now. Now, my personal interest is in the field of psychology, for which the framework of evolution provides a useful point of view. Is it true? Who cares, at least it’s useful.

It just seems to me that the whole discussion of which explanation is true is a waste of time and energy that would be better directed to other matters (such as stopping abortion, for instance).

No. I have cited to the Catechism and Church documents. Here is a quote from Communion and Stewardship, published by the Church with the express approval of then-head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Cardinal Ratzinger:

  1. According to the widely accepted scientific account, the universe erupted 15 billion years ago in an explosion called the “Big Bang” and has been expanding and cooling ever since.

From later in that same paragraph:

While the story of human origins is complex and subject to revision, physical anthropology and molecular biology combine to make a convincing case for the origin of the human species in Africa about 150,000 years ago in a humanoid population of common genetic lineage.

Now you say that YOUR personal interpretation of cherry picked and old Church statements and documents is more authoritative than what the current leaders of the Church say on the topic.

To be sure, you are free to believe whatever you want. I have absolutely no problem with that. But I do have a problem with telling people that may not know better that the Church teaches something it does not. The fact that you think the Church should teach Young Earth does not mean that it does. The Church’s teaching is clear, and anyone who is unsure should consult the Catechism: http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM
and Communion and Stewardship: http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/cti_documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20040723_communion-stewardship_en.html

more like “Creation”, His Word, illuminates science and history also.

well we all seek advancement in understanding…faith will always be needed…every advancement only directs another hundred questions

agree, for fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge and wisdom.

Like literal genealogy and Adam existing around 6000 years ago.

Any answer to them (Adam and Eve) being told to "replenish " the earth ?

I like to say man is very gifted in ability to make "observations’’, but it is the deductions from them that need “anointing”.

If it’s not true how useful can it be ?

Is it useful to, for only a moment, try and view an issue of morality from a Muslim, Hindu, or whatever other religion’s point of view? Yes it is, even if their position may not be correct, it is of some utility to see how others see the world.

Now, that addresses only one instance of utility, and it could plausibly be argued that a perspective on morality is on a different plane of truth than physical reality.

In that case, I will attempt to explain my viewpoint: a great interest of mine is the field of psychology; specifically, Jung’s take on it. I find that Jung’s perspective is rather novel and insightful. On a personal note, exposure to Jung (and interpretations of him and his theories by Joseph Campell and Jordan Peterson) led me down the path to the person I am now (and made me get considerably more devout than I previously was).

But Jung uses evolution in his discourse on the biological aspect of the development of myths. In doing so, the picture that he paints is hauntingly beautiful. What is to be made of this? Well, at the very least, the perspective is to be taken into account. The evolutionary framework is not to be simply rejected out of hand.
The question then devolves to what is to be put in place of that ingenious point of view. So far, none of the proposed replacements have (in my opinion) proven themselves superior.

Ok. I was talking of creation science, not necesarily morality

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Well, there are Catholic geocentrists, so likely there would be Catholic YEC advocates as well.

Lol…any flat earthers out there?

There used to be very active group of Catholic geocentrists on this forum. Haven’t heard from any of them in a while.

The term creationism has differing definitions…

The most important is: The Creator Created Creation

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Obviously we are all living on counter-Earth and are creations of the High Evolutionary.

I know who to ask.

The Prophet Thomas. Maybe he can enlighten us! Mayhap a strange golden-skinned man in red trunks will descend with a gem on his brow to lead up to Paradise. Whilst battling colourfully costumed foes of course.

I think he might know about Him.

I’m wondering does anyone else get these references.

Returning to YEC( great name for a comic book villain there…) it definitely is not a major force outside the US. I’ve only twice met people who believe in it in real life situations, most Protestants here would be ‘Er, yes and then we have the…odd fringe’ when considering it.

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