Your suggestions needed


#1

I’d like your suggestions on how to deal with the following without lying:

2002: bought car with husband.

2003: husband filed for divorce and car was awarded to me, along with the remaining debt.

2005: ex-husband files for bankruptcy and lists the car. He can do that as co-owner.

2006: I discover that I cannot sell or trade in the car without his signature. If I pay off the loan, I have been advised to forge his signature on the pink slip so that I can get rid of the car.

Is there another way to do this besides having to deal with him directly or lying? Maybe not, but thought I would ask for your input anyway.

Thanks.


#2

[quote=wacky&wonderful]I’d like your suggestions on how to deal with the following without lying:

2002: bought car with husband.

2003: husband filed for divorce and car was awarded to me, along with the remaining debt.

2005: ex-husband files for bankruptcy and lists the car. He can do that as co-owner.

2006: I discover that I cannot sell or trade in the car without his signature. If I pay off the loan, I have been advised to forge his signature on the pink slip so that I can get rid of the car.

Is there another way to do this besides having to deal with him directly or lying? Maybe not, but thought I would ask for your input anyway.

Thanks.
[/quote]

NEVER commit forgery! Whoever advised you to do it is wrong!
NEVER lie! if you have it on a lease, or financed it, it goes to the company. Can your trustee ask you both to sell it and pay off a loan if there is one? you need to talk to the trustee. Who legally owns the car? Both of you? If he has listed it in the bankruptcy,
you need advice from a trustee, or a bankruptcy lawyer. One should listen to advice from a person who would tell you to forge
someone’s signature!


#3

[quote=Marilena]One should listen to advice from a person who would tell you to forge someone’s signature!
[/quote]

A typo? I hope!


#4

Yes, it was a typo. My apologies. It is meant to say: One should NOT listen to one who gives bad advice.


#5

The car is in both of our names, but it was awarded to me in the divorce and it states that in the divorce decree. As long as I continue to make the payments and pay off the loan, nothing bad will happen. It’s just that I want to be able to dispose of the car at some point and not have to deal with him in any way. I’ve been told that if the decree says it is mine, his signature is not needed. Period. True? Anyone have this experience?


#6

[quote=wacky&wonderful]The car is in both of our names, but it was awarded to me in the divorce and it states that in the divorce decree. As long as I continue to make the payments and pay off the loan, nothing bad will happen. It’s just that I want to be able to dispose of the car at some point and not have to deal with him in any way. I’ve been told that if the decree says it is mine, his signature is not needed. Period. True? Anyone have this experience?
[/quote]

If the car is yours according to the divorce decree YOU CAN get rid of the car without your ex-husbands signature. The divorce decree overrides agreements, etc. made while you were married. So, co-ownership is a moot point. If I were you, I would go to the DMV and have the owenership of the car officially changed. It could save you some grief later.


#7

[quote=smartblkchick]If the car is yours according to the divorce decree YOU CAN get rid of the car without your ex-husbands signature. The divorce decree overrides agreements, etc. made while you were married. So, co-ownership is a moot point. If I were you, I would go to the DMV and have the owenership of the car officially changed. It could save you some grief later.
[/quote]

I thought I had to wait until I had the car paid off to have the title changed, but will check into it this coming week. Thank you, smartblkchick, you really are!


#8

The exact same thing happened to me. There are two ways to deal with this.

  1. Have your ex-husband sign it over to you. Easiest way if he is willing. You can also get the courts to order him to.

  2. Take the divorce decree to the DMV. There are forms to file and fees to pay, but they’ll take his name off. Only bad thing about this, is they will have to notify him of the attempt to remove his name from file. He will have some amount of time (usually 30 days) to contest. If he doesn’t, it’ll be yours. If he does, problems abound, and you’ll end up in court anyway.


#9

[quote=wacky&wonderful]The car is in both of our names, but it was awarded to me in the divorce and it states that in the divorce decree. As long as I continue to make the payments and pay off the loan, nothing bad will happen. It’s just that I want to be able to dispose of the car at some point and not have to deal with him in any way. I’ve been told that if the decree says it is mine, his signature is not needed. Period. True? Anyone have this experience?
[/quote]

Heres the best advice you are going to get from anyone.

CONTACT THE LAWYER WHOM HANDLED YOUR DIVORCE
this can be a very touchy issue with him filing bancruptcy.
the money used to pay off the loan from you could possibly go to the courts to pay off his bancruptcy… seek a lawyer

good luck


#10

[quote=smartblkchick]If the car is yours according to the divorce decree YOU CAN get rid of the car without your ex-husbands signature. The divorce decree overrides agreements, etc. made while you were married. So, co-ownership is a moot point. If I were you, I would go to the DMV and have the owenership of the car officially changed. It could save you some grief later.
[/quote]

As long as the husband is a registered co-owner and still named on the title of the car, then the OP cannot sell the car without the husband’s signature. Doesn’t matter what the dissolution decree says…it is not proof enough to have the car titled in the OP’s name.

We just ran into this in our office, only it was with a timeshare condo. The son of a deceased owner (his mother) of a timeshare wanted to enlist our services (law firm) to change the title of the unit to himself.

The title on the unit was listed in both her name and her ex-husband’s (our client’s step-dad) name. Their divorce decree stated she received the Colorado condo as part of their settlement, and the husband received another condo.

The decree was not enough to change the title. We would have had to file in the county a pleading to determine heirship in both owner’s names (both were deceased), and we would have had to include the step-dad’s children.

After all this rambling, my point is that this is not an uncommon event. When a couple gets divorced, and wife gets this property and husband gets that property, and it is all laid out in the decree, most people leave it at that. What should happen next is the proper title documents be executed to reflect the decree details.

OP, I suggest, if you can, go through your lawyers. Have your lawyer send the title to his lawyer and have his client sign the title and get the vehicle in your name as soon as possible. Good luck, and God bless.


#11

Here, here on the lawyers! (I am not one.) There are all sorts of little quirks in the Bankruptcy process. Don’t proceed with anything without knowing them.

I am not a lawyer and I’ve never gone through a bankruptcy! These are possible problems I could see if you acted now.

  1. Selling or giving away property in order to keep it from being used in the bankruptcy proceedings is forbidden. I think the courts can actually invalidate the sale or gift and take it anyway (even in cases where the person it was sold to had no idea). So don’t get him to “sign it over to you” without talking to a lawyer.

  2. Bankruptcy filings automatically stop all collections agencies from trying to collect. So your car is safe so long as the proceeding is underway. Don’t feel like you have to act quickly to keep the car and in your haste do something that will come back to bite you in the butt. You have time to consult a lawyer.

  3. Your ex-husband will have to list his debts and his assests, which the court will divy up. Did he list your car on this list?

  4. If your property is subject to the suit, you might have to go to his bankruptcy hearing and ask to have your car removed from his property inventory.

  5. He will have to jump through several hoops. If he misses any, his case will be thrown out. You might not even have to deal with it.

  6. He will have a caseworker assigned to his case. You can contact this person. I wouldn’t recommend doing so on your own without talking to a lawyer first because it might make things worse for you. But you do have the right.

  7. Is there any way the car can be paid off in the next couple months and the title clearly put in your name? Then it would just take the divorce decree to have his name removed and you wouldn’t have to work through him. Worth looking into.

  8. I would assume that this is a very common problem. I doubt the bankruptcy courts would order you to sell your car and the proceeds go to your ex-husband’s debt. Especially considering that the debt is now his (per the decree) and the car is now yours (per the decree). He’ll be expected to bring that decree to the bankruptcy proceedings. So it will probably be annoying to deal with, but your car is most likely perfectly safe.


#12

as far as selling or buying the car with both names i cant speak for all states but here in MI i had a dodge 4 wheel drive truck, was in my name alone and the exmonster

gave it away with no title anything I found the truck a few months later and called police which would NOT let me file a stolen vehicle
report but said i could get it back if i found it, till i found it. when i found it i was told by the state police officer that because a buiseness was in posession of it i lost…
They got to sell MY truck, I got squat and still had to pay it off exmonster got to laugh, and whats worse is i won the truck in the divorce, I was out of town when she gave it away but she claimed she gave it away 3 weeks earlier that the person just didnt pick it up
which put it to days before final divorce and made it just as much her property as mine even though was totally in my name…
I think its BS and can see now why ex’s get shot instead of doing it the legal way,


#13

[quote=wacky&wonderful]The car is in both of our names, but it was awarded to me in the divorce and it states that in the divorce decree. As long as I continue to make the payments and pay off the loan, nothing bad will happen. It’s just that I want to be able to dispose of the car at some point and not have to deal with him in any way. I’ve been told that if the decree says it is mine, his signature is not needed. Period. True? Anyone have this experience?
[/quote]

It was my experience, in California, that a copy of divorce decree taken to the DMV got the other person’s name off the pink slip.


#14

[quote=wacky&wonderful]The car is in both of our names…
[/quote]

By both names, do you mean the title is expressed as John and Joan Smith or as John or Joan Smith? It makes a huge difference. If it is or, his signature would not be needed under any circumstances.

Typically, my wife and I title any of our property as or, that way if anything would happen to one of us the property would not be encumbered in any way.


#15

For the records a tid bit of advice for everyone here.

This has nothing to do with a divorce or anything like it

I have been told by lawyers for forever that a car should never ever be in both peoples names in a marriage unless it absolutly has to due to a loan as if you are in a bad accident the other party can sue you to the point of being able to take away everything including a house that you both or separately own, if a car is in one persons name they can only go as far as what that person owns,which generally means they cannot touch your home as most times that is in both spouses names.

check your states clarifications but remember if you travel whatever state you are in the laws there take over…

I hope this never may have help someone

                                           John

#16

Does this mean that we should all put the cars in one person’s name? But if their name is on all of the other assets, what difference would that make?

And to the OP, are you certain that your husband gave you all the keys to your car, even copies? Can you take your car to a dealership or locksmith and change the locks and have new keys made? Don’t forget to give copy of the new set to a trusted family member or friend.


#17

[quote=wacky&wonderful]I’d like your suggestions on how to deal with the following without lying:

2002: bought car with husband.

2003: husband filed for divorce and car was awarded to me, along with the remaining debt.

2005: ex-husband files for bankruptcy and lists the car. He can do that as co-owner.

2006: I discover that I cannot sell or trade in the car without his signature. If I pay off the loan, I have been advised to forge his signature on the pink slip so that I can get rid of the car.

Is there another way to do this besides having to deal with him directly or lying? Maybe not, but thought I would ask for your input anyway.

Thanks.
[/quote]

No need to forge signatures. The car belongs to you. Take your divorce decree with you if there is any question as to your ownership.


#18

[quote=Cupofkindness]Does this mean that we should all put the cars in one person’s name? But if their name is on all of the other assets, what difference would that make?

And to the OP, are you certain that your husband gave you all the keys to your car, even copies? Can you take your car to a dealership or locksmith and change the locks and have new keys made? Don’t forget to give copy of the new set to a trusted family member or friend.
[/quote]

The monthly statement from GMAC states that I am the agent for the ex. I questioned this initially, but was told that is the way it has to be until the loan is paid off. I have negative equity in the car, I owe over $3,000 and it is worth just $700 since the a/c is broken. I drive for my job, so have to carry full insurance coverage. I can hit anyone I want! :wink: I learned how to disable the car by removing the fuel pump fuse. I doubt that he would come after the car, he has enough other problems at the moment.

I am definitely going to contact the lousy lawyer I had to see what she can do. He didn’t get a lawyer for the divorce, instead he would go and ask my lawyer questions and she told me she would tell him “I am S’s lawyer, but you can do this…” Sheesh…


#19

The best way is probably to get correct legal advice in your own state. However, I have personally seen two cases where a auto was old and no longer working, but could not be disposed of in the usual fashion because the title was not clear, and fixing the title was more trouble than the car was worth.

In these cases, a junk dealer agreed to hual off the old car. The junk dealer neither paid nor was was paid for this, they just towed it off to their lot by mutual agreement. The junk dealer then kept the car for a few months, and then filed paperwork with the state indicating that the vehicle was abandoned. The junk dealer was then permitted to dispose of the vehicle legally, and salvaged any useful parts, thereby being compensated for their trouble.


#20

[quote=she_he]For the records a tid bit of advice for everyone here.

This has nothing to do with a divorce or anything like it

I have been told by lawyers for forever that a car should never ever be in both peoples names in a marriage unless it absolutly has to due to a loan as if you are in a bad accident the other party can sue you to the point of being able to take away everything including a house that you both or separately own, if a car is in one persons name they can only go as far as what that person owns,which generally means they cannot touch your home as most times that is in both spouses names.

check your states clarifications but remember if you travel whatever state you are in the laws there take over…

I hope this never may have help someone

                                           John

[/quote]

That is very interesting. I’ve worked in law offices in both community property states and separate property states, and I’ve never heard this before. I would think that whether or not you live in a community property state would be a big factor into that, though.


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